Would this be worthy (attributed to " Settsu Tadayuki") ?

[gauze3539]

Hi there.

This sword is attributed to " Settsu Tadayuki ". Other than anything, I thought the good thing about this sword is the condition of the blade, which is super nice and thick. Especially, I like the hamon pattern as well. I think it also never been done polishing since nie and nioi lines look fairly clear, but can you tell me whether it's polished or not by looking at those photos? Also, would it be fair price and worthy to get if it's around 2.5~3k? If you can pour down your opinion into here, it would be really appreciate. I have looked at many of those Juyo and Tokubetsu token and I am not there yet to distinguish what criteria actually makes blade level goes up and down and how much exactly. so it becomes really tricky. I don't know it's because of the way how the photo has been taken, to me, at least, looks like Tokubetsu quality although it's just Hozon Token. What do you guys think?

Thanks a lot.

 

Jason. C

 

p.s: By the way, the sword came out from estate sale, not from auctioneer, broker, nor nihonto seller.

[kusunokimasahige]

No image of link Jason

 

KM

[gauze3539]

Sorry kusunokimasahige!

I had to cut down the size of images. Now it's on Thanks.

 

 

Jason C.

[hxv]

I saw this sword on ebay. Price-wise, it's a good deal for a papered sword. The sword looks to be in good shape. To answer your question, mumei shinto swords do not get Tokubetsu Hozon. In fact, even signed shinto swords do not get Tokubetsu Hozon if they has been shortened.

 

Hoanh

[gauze3539]

Thank you hoanh. Then it's hard to even expect to turn it in again for the next level in the future?. That's,,,,,,,,, not too cool .

[hxv]

Jason,

 

No, Hozon is all you can expect for a mumei shinto sword. If this is your first sword, you did well. Enjoy the sword.

 

Hoanh

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

In fact, even signed shinto swords do not get Tokubetsu Hozon if they has been shortened.

 

Shinto suriage swords can get Tokuho if the mei is entirely present.

[gauze3539]

yes it is. I have been collecting WWII Wehrmacht stuffs only for 15 years and now all my sense and nerve system eventually started kick into this field. And I like it a lot. Yes. It would be my first nihonto. I've never had one before. I had held one of those nihonto from muromachi for a couple months from the friend of mine so I had a really good chance to study NIHONTO. Now, it's time to step into the first level and I feel like I can learn a lot more because now I have my own blade and Nihonto Message Board together right here. Thanks a lot honah for the good news that I made a good choice. That just makes me feel good.

 

Jason C.

[gauze3539]

Thanks Jacques. But this sword has no mei. so I guess it's almost 0 chance.....

 

 

Jason C.

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

Right, it has no chance,

 

I don't know it's because of the way how the photo has been taken, to me, at least, looks like Tokubetsu quality although it's just Hozon Token. What do you guys think?

 

Nobody can really say something about artistic qualities of a sword without having the sword in hands (even scholars).

[Jacques]

Jean

 

Merci de ne pas modérer à tort et à travers

[Jean]

Merci de ne pas modérer à tort et à travers

 

???????????????????????????????

 

I never moderate "à tort et à travers". I lock topics when topics are deteriorating or when they are circling without any decisive step ex: Moroha zukuri. I never erase or modify posts by editing them except mine though it will be very easy for me having access to all posts :D .

[hxv]

Jacques,

 

Shinto suriage swords can get Tokuho if the mei is entirely present.

 

Would you say that the statement above is the norm or the exception?

 

Hoanh

[Jean]

Hoanh,

 

You should know this article by heart if you don't want to be disappointed one day.

 

If I remember well, years ago, Danny had a suriage Izumi no kami Fujiwara Kunisada (1st generation) for sale which was TH.

 

http://www.nihontocraft.com/Nihonto_Shi ... dards.html

 

====>Exception

 

Of course we are obviously in the NBTHK system.

[hxv]

Thank you Jean. That's what I thought as well. In my opinion, statements that express the exception rather than the norm should be qualified for the benefit of new collectors. Once again, thank you for the clarification, Jean.

 

Regards,

Hoanh

[Jean]

Hoanh,

 

You are right. Every collector/NMB member should know this article. :D

[gauze3539]

" d. Muromachi and Edo period mumei blades may not receive a Tokubetsu Hozon paper, as a rule. However, if a blade shows good workmanship, attributable to a famous smith, having ubu-nakago, and in good preservation, it may receive Tokubetsu Hozon paper."

 

Doesn't it show a possibility to get Tokuho in the future for the blade? It seems to me there could be an exception although it's mumei and edo sword. I can't be sure if this blade shows a good workmanship, nor Tadayuki in Settsu is famous. But what I can be sure is it's in good preservation and having ubu-nakago. Am I right? And non of articles on the standard shows an absolute denial. Rather, it says "~~~~ may not receive~~". So nobody is really sure unless it's submitted to a Shinsa and having them to appraise the blade?. It's very confusing.

 

Jason C.

[gauze3539]

e. Suriage cut-mei Edo blades may not receive Tokubetsu Hozon paper.

 

 

This gave me the end of future lucks for this blade. lol

 

 

Jason C.

[hxv]

Jason,

 

There is nothing to be bumped out about. For a first blade, it's much nicer than what most of us had for our first blade. The price is an outright steal for a papered blade in good polish. If I am not mistaken, Settsu Tadayuki is ranked Josaku - an excellent smith. Enjoy the sword! You did very well.

 

Hoanh

[Jussi Ekholm]

There were 4 generations of Settsu Tadayuki what I can read from my books. 1st gen. is Chusaku (Fujishiro), Ryôwazamono, and 3 Million Yen (Toko Taikan) 70 points (Hawley). 2nd gen. is Chusaku and Wazamono, 2,5 Million Yen, 15 points. 3rd is wazamono, 2 Million Yen, 15 points. 4th 2,5 Million Yen, 15 points.

 

Also in Token Kakaku Jiten there are two Tadayuki listed. I think they are both listed at 2 Million Yen, unfortunately I can't read Japanese well enough for whole description but one is Kanbun era (1st) and another Tenwa (2nd).

 

Only brief mentions of Tadayuki in Nihonto Koza and Yamanaka.

 

That is about all the info in my books that I can give about this lineage of smiths.

[hxv]

Thank you for the info, Jussi. Jason should have plenty of leads to search out on the relevant workmanship now.

 

Regards,

Hoanh

[gauze3539]

Yea Hoanh. Only word I understand what Jussi said is chu saku. I am going to study now for that smith rating system. Thank you for saying that, which I want to hear from profound members . You read my mind. I haven't got the sword yet but I try to go down to meet the guy and get the sword on this weekend hopefully. Thanks.

 

Jason C.