Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 http://www.ebay.com/itm/350708708017?ss ... 1423.l2649 What am I missing here? There were 3 people with bids of 1500$ or higher... Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 Are you puzzled by the result of the auction or by the fact that I don't understand it? :D Quote
Kai-Gunto Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 I think if it gets a polish, it would be a very nice wakizashi. Maybe a polisher is the buyer? Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 Idk, the rust appears too deep, at least to me. I was thinking that after polish the result would be some ji-are. Maybe those members who have experience with this kind of situation (deep rust) care to comment. So, 1650$ for a wakizashi in need of a very good polish and with a lot of chances at kizu? Indeed, your scenario is the only one that makes sense, but I thought good polishers aren't exactly in dire need of work. Quote
Kai-Gunto Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 Your right. Blade looks like it has a nice hamon. I have not tranlated the mei. Have You? Quote
cabowen Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 The koshirae is in restorable condition with all the kodogu complete. The rust is mostly superficial and the blade should polish without a problem. It has an attractive hamon and appears sound. It is signed. The price paid seems reasonable in light of its potential. How many blades have you had polished? What are ji-are? Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 Japanese blades none (of course). Other type of swords, quite a lot. From my experience (again, not with Japanese swords) that kind of "flake" aspect of the rust usually means deep rust. Of course, in different climates and with different types of steel rust might take different appearances, hence my question. But again, given the cost of the polish and the cost of having the koshirae restored, would this blade sound like a reasonable gamble at 1650$ purchase price? I thought not (by a country mile). P.S. I thought ji-are were surfaces where you can see the core steel. Considered non-fatal kizu, but... from here http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/kizu.htm Quote
cabowen Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 It takes a lot of experience to know whether or not a blade can be restored. There are many factors that come into play: age of the blade, school/smith, corrosion type and location, experience and expertise of one's polisher, etc. In the end, even then, one never know with certainty- it is still a bit of a gamble. But I can say, after having many many blades polished, that more often than not, what I thought was too far gone was restored flawlessly. There is no such thing as ji-are. Perhaps you are referring to "ware", which are flaws in the forging. Rust, or its removal, doesn't cause ware. Removing rust can expose core steel (shintetsu) when the skin steel (kawagane) is penetrated. Restoration and shinsa for this sword, if done in the US, might run $2000 or so. $3600 into it might be hard to get out, but if it is as attractive a blade as it appears it could be, it might make the new owner quite happy for a long time. It isn't always about profit and loss..... Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 I totally agreee with you about the last sentence, but again, what would be the "selling point" of this wakizashi for a collector that can afford (and knows where) to have it polihed and so on? I'm really curious. The term I used (ji-are)was taken from the kizu page on the website I linked in my previous post. If this term is incorrect/doesn't exist what is the correct term for the exposed shintetsu? I'd rather use correct terms but if no one mentions them is hard to catch on . Quote
cabowen Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 When the shintetsu is exposed, the sword is said to be tired, (tsukareta or tsukare). The selling point is an original koshirae and a quality blade. I looked at your link. Not sure where they are getting that term. The shintetsu doesn't "stick up" in any case..... I have never heard it before. Doesn't mean it doesn't exist, may be very uncommon (???).... Quote
John A Stuart Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 地荒 Ji are. A rough patch on the ji of the sword usually as a result of being tired from over polishing. John Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 Thank you John. So it would apply to shintetsu being exposed because of excessive polishing? ("rough patch" seems somehow generic) I looked at your link. Not sure where they are getting that term. The shintetsu doesn't "stick up" in any case..... I have never heard it before. Doesn't mean it doesn't exist, may be very uncommon (???).... I hope nothing that I wrote here was leading to the impression that I believed the shintetsu would "stick up". On that web site they seem to use the term ji-are for two different kizu: 1. the one we're talking about (exposed shintetsu caused by excessive polishing) - which is also ilustrated in the third picture at the start of their page 2. a raised area, indicative of underlying blister Quote
John A Stuart Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 荒 can be used in the sense of 'to raise' as in 荒らげる Not a great term for fukure I think. John Quote
Adrian Posted February 12, 2013 Author Report Posted February 12, 2013 Nope, they don't use it for fukure. More like a) "exposed shintetsu" and b) "hidden fukure", so to speak. Fukure is listed as a different kizu. Quote
cabowen Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 I have heard the term ji arai (地荒い) meaning "rough ji" but not "ji are"....I probably just don't get out enough.... Quote
John A Stuart Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 Yes declension of the verb. John Quote
John A Stuart Posted February 12, 2013 Report Posted February 12, 2013 Haaaaa! Yes an adjective 形容詞 keiyoushi. Keeping me honest, eh? Good one. John Quote
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