Curran,
Yes I agree about the Haynes catalogues, they were a moment in time, not unlike the Joly's before, knowledge moves forward.
It's interesting that Robert Buraway said in "The Picture Book of Old Tsuba" that under the heading of Hoan and Yamakichibei, "Never seen a real one in the west!"
Was he only thinking of the first and second?
Is he right??
David