Beater teppo

[Fabian23]

Hello all the way from snowy Switzerland!

 

I joined this forum since most of my internet queries on Japanese muskets led me here almost to the antipode.

 

Many firearms wash up here from all over the world and I came across this teppo for very very little a bit before christmas. I had one many moons ago which I was forced to sell so I was keen to get a replacement. I bought it with the intention of restoring it where necessary so be able to take at least a few shots with it so purists be warned 

 

To my inexpert eye it appears to be a plain military musket, possibly even a composite piece for display.

 

The barrel is 101cm long with a gently flaring muzzle and from what I can gather from a first translation over on gunboards, the markings indicate a double wrap barrel made by Goshu Kunitomo Kyubei Yasumine. The bore size is approximately 12-13mm and internally lightly pitted but not irreparably so. As seems to be quite common, the pan cover is missing so that is on the to do list. I had to make one of my previous one too so it isn't my first rodeo.

 

 

The top of the barrel has a five petaled flower kamon which I have not been able to identify although the closest I could find was "Oda" and the underside of the stock has what appears to be a lead or pewter "Ii" kamon. 

 

The lock is plain with no markings. When I received it the sear axis pin was missing and the sear had been punched, but not drilled for the pin, nor had the tail of the sear been adjusted correctly to allow sufficient retraction of the sear nose upon pulling the trigger. An axis pin has been made and the sear tail was been correctly bent to funtion properly with the trigger. The serpentine axis pin was also far too lose, causing the serpentine to slip the sear nose if the musket was knocked so I made a new one of those too. The serpentine no longer wobbles and the lockwork now operates smoothly and safely. Oddly the lockplate was also slightly too large, as in a fraction of a millimetre. This could be due to wood shrinkage or the lock is not original to the musket, either way, some careful light sanding was all that was necessary to make the lockplate fit snug in the stock.

 

The stock has what lookes like a period repair on the left side of the barrel channel with a 20cm long insert of matching wood bonded in place. Aside from that it is in good condition. A small section just ahead of the pan had a few woodworm holes but these have been treated and filled and the odd non-structurally significant cracks stabilized and filled. The original ramrod is present but unfortunately it was snapped off flush with the end of the barrel channel. Luckily it came out easily pushing it out with a pin in the expansion slot.

 

The discrepency between the crest on the barrel and the crest on the stock and the not-quite-fitting unfinished lock make me think that this is perhaps a composite display piece, which makes my restoration (perhaps) a little less blasphemous.

 

Any observations as to its possible origins and approximate date would be appreciated. When I get around to firing it I'll have plenty more questions because I'd love to try out some "Hayago" quickloaders.

 

p.s I am aware that it appears to be the convention for people to refer to the components of Japanese arms using strickly Japanese terminology, why is this? When I write in English about the lock counterplate on one of my french muskets I don't call it a contreplatine or nor do I refer to the Stecherabzug when writing about the set trigger on one of my German guns. I find it baffling,  anyway apologies for not doing so, I have enough languages in my head already 

[Bugyotsuji]

Hi Fabian, Happy New Year! 
congratulations on your second Tanegashima long gun. There is so much information you give it that is hard to know where to start, but thank you for your detailed explanation regarding your on-going project.

 

From what we can see in your photos it looks like a genuine piece, with even some parts present that are often missing. A too-tight lock plate is quite common, for the reasons you give. Unfortunately very hard to date without some further detailed indications, but most likely to have been made in the c.1750-1840 timeframe, from which most survive.

 

Do not worry about the Mon. Many of these were added later to give extra cachet. The top design is ‘Mokkō’ and Oda Mokkō is perhaps the best known. The one on the base of the butt certainly looks wrong. A plain metal disk or wooden plug would be somewhat better, imho.

 

For target shooting or game? The bore is rather small for a serious army gun. They start from around 1.4 cm up to 1.7 cm. 
 

The gun looks to be in good hands. Will you repatinate it? 
 

I have had much enjoyment making my own ramrods and hayago tubes.

 

Please let us know how the shooting goes, and take it easy on the blackpowder to start with!

 

PS A Tenpo/Tempo gun by your smith is listed in a record of Kunitomo gunsmiths, with a bore of 2 Monmé. 

[Bugyotsuji]

These are all Kyubei smiths from Kunitomo. Yours may be the seventh.(?)

 

 

 

 

[Fabian23]

Thank you very much for the information!

 

The seventh on the list does indeed look like the likely candidate.

 

I'll post pictures of the stock once I've finished with it.

 

The barrel was this shiny grey when I got it. I used a marker pen to bring out the text for the photo. Should the barrel be blued or browned?

 

For the bore size it is quite odd since it also appears to flare out internally towards the muzzle, with the main bore being just over 12mm and tapering out over the last 7cm to about 13mm at the muzzle. Depending on the windage a 2 monmé ball could be correct if it roughly equals 11mm. I'm using engine cylinder flex hones to clean it up btw. A long slow process but it seems to be working.

I wouldn't expect muzzle wear from wooden ramrods so I was wondering if the bore taper was perhaps intentional to aid loading?

 

More questions:

Are there historical records of typical powder loads?

I have not been able to determine whether balls were loaded tightly patched in the bore, sandwiched between wads like a shotgun or as loose rolling ball.

[Bugyotsuji]

Internal bore taper may indicate later use of a metal ramrod towards the end of the Bakumatsu when every ounce of bang was demanded from these old muskets.

 

I have seen a tray of lead ball prewrapped in washi paper square patches for a tighter fit. When guns came over from the West, a huge amount of interest meant that such wadding details were eagerly copied and passed on during the last 50 years of the late Muromachi and Momoyama periods. As to the correct amount of black powder, I think you should consult one of the muzzle shooting associations, especially in the US. They will know about Tanegashima, which do well at smoothbore events, but they work in ‘grains’, which I do not fully understand.

 

Here in Japan we are issued with 10 grams for a large long gun, 8 for a smaller bore and 6 for slim barrels, but this is for blank firing. (For my hand cannon they give me 50 grams.) I would start with perhaps no more than 5 grams and a loose ball until you find your comfort zone, and later insert wadding between powder and ball. These guns bear no proof test marks, so there is an element of pot luck!  (One of our troop put 8 grams down his little gun barrel and blew the pan and lid off over the watching crowd. In 20+ years of demonstrations, I have seen barrels rupture in spectacular fashion a couple of times, one iron and one bronze. Generally though, Tanegashima have a good reputation for reliability, even today.)

 

Opinions will vary on how to repatinate. One of our members always uses gun blue, with good black results, almost new looking, but first the barrel must be totally free of any oil residue. I brought a bottle of gun brown back to Japan with me a few years ago but I’ve never seen anyone using it, so I cannot really say. I hope others will join in here and fill in the gaps in my knowledge!

 

Looking forward to extra shots of the barrel, breech screw, stock and butt, etc.

 

 

[Fabian23]

I have not attempted to remove the breech screw. The end surface viewed with an endoscopic camera looks fine so I will not attempt to remove it.

 

Another piece I need to remake is the little curved butt cap insert. The original was split at the bend. Lots of filing work ahead.

 

Re-repatination: My question was what colour should the barrel be? Black, blue, brown?

[Bugyotsuji]

Many of those butt protectors get damaged, but they mainly did their job!

 

As to the breech screw it’s obviously up to the owner. Some are so rusted shut they break under undue force. Some Tanegashima gun barrels are actually solid at the butt end, i.e. they do not have a ‘Bisen’ screw. It makes for a tighter seal in the system. You can swab out the barrel when you clean it. 

[Fabian23]

Work in progress. Last time I did this I did it all by hand. A mill makes it much easier.

 

 

[Alex A]

With the title, expected to see a junk wall hanger but its far from it.

 

Looks ok to me and good that it is signed.

[Fabian23]

4 minutes ago, Alex A said:

With the title, expected to see a junk wall hanger but its far from it.

 

Looks ok to me and good that it is signed.

The amount of tweeking needed to finish the lock off properly and the difference in mon on the lock and stock made me question the homogeneity of the piece.

 

Glad to find out here that it appears authentic 😊 

[Fabian23]

Update 2:

Most critical phase, drilling the axis pin hole, is done. If I had messed it up I would have had to start all over again.

 

Now it’s lots of shaping and filing.

 

[Fabian23]

Almost there

 

[Brian]

Where can I send mine to have done by you?
Great job. I expect you'll break all the edges, and patinate with some ammonia, will look fantastic.

[Fabian23]

Thanks! I have proceeded in very small steps every day, planning ahead what cuts to make and how, to ensure I don’t mess up. One turn of the handle the wrong way on the mill and it’s back to zero. Drilling the pin hole required making a simple sacrificial jig which then served as a guide for drilling the real piece.

 

Now it is indeed just a case of finishing a bit of shaping by hand, smoothing the edges and patinating. The axis pin will be a quick lathe job.

[Brian]

Axis pin, if I remember correctly, isn't a solid drilled tube. I know it can be turned, but if you want to be authentic (and maybe @Bugyotsuji can confirm) it's a rolled sheet metal tube with a head....depends on how authentic you want to make it. Or maybe turn it, and cut a slit down the side so it looks rolled? May stand corrected.

[Fabian23]

Interesting, I’ve been looking for clues online as to its composition. I had assumed it was a solid hollow pin with a head. I have seen some also with a cross hole just under the lower surface of the pan. I’m not too fussy about originality but if it’s easy to make it the original way then why not.

[Brian]

The bottom hole takes a thin wire twisted to make sure it doesn't come out. Top of the pin/tube is hollow to take a little paper "umbrella" in case of rain.

[Fabian23]

30 minutes ago, Brian said:

The bottom hole takes a thin wire twisted to make sure it doesn't come out. Top of the pin/tube is hollow to take a little paper "umbrella" in case of rain.

 

One more reason to have little paper cocktail umbrellas at home

[Fabian23]

If anyone can clarify the construction of the axis pin I would be very grateful  

[Brian]

This forum will surprise you :-)
https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/14358-how-to-make-tanegashima-pan-cover-hollow-pin/#comment-150718

https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/35224-please-help-to-identify-my-hinawaju/page/2/#comment-364917

 

[Fabian23]

This is truly a wonderful forum thank you 🙏 

[Fabian23]

After much contemplation and trial and error I have finished off the axis pin. I first tried the rolling method using a piece of sheet brass taken off a  brass 12g shotgun shell rolled around a 3mm drill bit, which worked but the brass was too thin, about 0.2mm. Instead I rummaged around my bits boxes and found a 4mm brass tube with 0,5mm wall thickness - perfect!

 

I cut a 3cm section, slit it down one side, annealed with a short blast of the blowtorch it to make it pliable and then gently hammered it on the 3mm drill bit to make the sides of the slit meet. The diameter was still slightly too big for the hole in the pan so I used the hole itself as a die to size the brass tube down to the right diameter by tapping it through. 
 

On the lathe I cut down a piece of bar stock to form the axis pin head, inserted the brass tube and soldered it in. All that remained was shaping the head with hand files and fine grit paper, drilling the cross hole for the wire and trimming the pin to length. 😊 

 

Ammonia patination next and then it’s making a new stock cap 💪

[Bugyotsuji]

That really does look as good as dammit, Fabian. Good work.

 

Some of my teppō have original pins, others were made later. Many years ago I bought a beautiful Hino gun at a sword-and-gun shop in town. The pin was missing from the pan lid/cover. When I pointed this out, the Bantō walked over to the Tanegashima which were stacked against the wall, had a quick look through, and casually extracted one for my ‘new’ acquisition. (Someone else’s problem from then on!)

[Fabian23]

Stock cap finished and tacked in like the original. The fit is 99% there but I don’t think I can improve on it without a few decades of apprenticeship. Much harder than I thought it would be. 
 

[Bugyotsuji]

Good job! No-one would spot that, I bet. Nice invisible rivets too! We only know your secret because you have told us! 

[Fabian23]

Well I have to make it good enough that I can sell it as 100% original for a billion dollars when I retire