Jump to content

It's raining Masamune!

Stever
 Share

Recommended Posts

Bungo Veteran

Bungo

Posted
Posted
Another one, lol!

 

http://cgi.ebay.ca/SAMURAI-Katana-Japanese_W0QQitemZ290062979868QQihZ019QQcategoryZ73466QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Still, it looks nice.

 

BTW, what's the deal with that other thread? Is posting eBay auction URLs an issue now for some reason?

 

Cheers,

/steve

 

I think the Daimyo took that particular link off because the seller is quite " up tight " about people talking about his auctions.

Like who needs hassles at this time of year, right ? As if we don't have enough to worry about global warming , food poisoning from taco bell, Olive Garden etc. etc................

 

milt THE ronin

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brian

Brian

Posted
Posted

Folks..if you will read carefully..you will see that the original poster decided to remove the link himself...and before I had even seen the thread.

There are no rules against posting this type of link here...although in some cases it is not worth the hassle that some sellers can start.

 

Wise move..but not prompted by me :)

Anyone who browses eBay enough has seen these auctions and the seller.

 

Brian

Link to comment
Share on other sites
John A Stuart

John A Stuart

Posted
Posted

Hi All, This thread leads me to discuss an issue that is kind of important. If someone puts an item for sale in the public's eye then we should have the right to discuss its' merits or lack thereof. A major part of what discussion forums is about is learning and in the process save a shilling or two. I find it sad to be under threat of sanction from sellers that can not have their merchandise bear the weight of scrutiny and discussion. Last year I had a fellow from the States phone me about some innocuous comment about some auction piece of his wife's' that I had caused a diminished return on. That is what honest opinion gets you. I stress honest, because our comments must be sincere and not intentionally harmful, no matter how deserving they may be. We as a community of collectors have a responsibility to each other to eliminate dishonesty. I didn't mean to jump upon a soapbox but I felt it had to be said again. I just wanted to add that there are members of this board with the expertise to assist when unsure about something via PM. I thank them. John

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brian

Brian

Posted
Posted

John,

 

It is for those reasons above that posting of links IS allowed here.

Although there have been threats before and sometimes it is just a hassle...I am sticking with this policy as long as the posts are factual (or clearly stated as opinion) and there is no outright slander or auction tampering.

 

Of course it isn't pleasant being threatened with all sorts of horribles...so sometimes it is just much easier to delete the info when the debate has finished. As Milt said..sometimes you can do it..but it is just not worth the hassle. Other than that..carry on all, and just make sure the debate you wish to start is beneficial in some way and not just a quest for controversy.

 

Brian

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Somin Apprentice

Somin

Posted
Posted

Hi all, I am new to the forum but have been around eBay for several loops around the local star.

 

Every hundred or so eBay transactions you run into a guy/gal who "just isn't worth it". Trust me, this was one of those times. :roll:

 

I didn't want my first posting on this forum to stir up poop. That honor appears to be reserved for a select few among us - although I am off to a good start 8)

 

This ones not over for me but no point in having it spill onto this forum..

 

Later,

 

Pez

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

I must contact my best friend back in the UK! He owns a nice wakizashi signed "Masamune" which we've always laughed about.

However, if Daimyo's "one handed tachi" is totally genuine (as he seems to suggest with his "origami") then my friend could be sitting on a small fortune! Talking of which, why isn't Daimyo charging $3,000,000 instead of $3,000......he must be in a very festive mood (Ho Ho Ho).

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

Thanks Peter,

Where I live in Japan (Kanagawa Prefecture) is actually what used to be called Soshu during the feudal era and the last time I visited Kamakura (not very far away) I was shown around the forge and workshop of a swordsmith called..........yes, you guessed it, Masamune!

This particular tosho and his students claim an unbroken lineage from the famous man himself so maybe the origami on eBay is acually perfectly legitimate and not penned by "Daimyo's" granddaughter practicing her calligraphy as I first suspected.

Happy Christmas and New Year!

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Gaijin Contributor

Gaijin

Posted
Posted
ill try and carve a masamune mei in my zink-alloy katana replica and put it online hahahahaha i have heard there are a lot of fake papers around these days........

 

:lol:

 

KM

 

actually some people do sell just a papers, i don't know they are fake or real, but you can buy them from same daimyou54jp

 

here:

 

http://page11.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/n50007826

http://page10.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/m39444111

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

I agree with kusunokimasahige. If these are lost (or stolen) NBTHK or NTHK papers, then it is probably far simpler for a half-gifted craftsman to mock up a nakago to look like the B&W pictures on the papers than to forge the papers themselves......especially if the blade described is mumei.

I am reminded of a friend of mine who bought a Tokubetsu Hozon shinto katana from Aoi Art in Tokyo. The blade (which was beautiful and had a saya-gaki by Dr Kanzan Sato) arrived safely in the UK, but NOT the NBTHK origami. Aoi Art took full responsibilty and very fairly offered my friend either a substantial discount or to resubmit the sword to shinsa at their expense. He agreed to the second option and, when the sword actually FAILED the Tokubetsu Hozon shinsa and only achieved Hozon, he was given a full refund by Aoi Art.

Still, it makes you wonder what happened to those papers?

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

Interesting! However, I'd still only trust papers issued directly from either the NBTHK or NTHK as they are the only ones not trying to sell me anything (except their expertise, of course).

Like many Westerners, I originally had a rose-tinted vision of the very "honourable" Japanese (especially as I'm married to a Japanese woman and she's extremely honourable!) but as soon as I moved here I quickly realised that their are just as many con-men waiting to part you from your hard-earned Yen as in the US or England!

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites
sencho Mentor

sencho

Posted
Posted

Hi Simon,

 

My business is based in Kanagawa and Florida so I see both sides of the coin on a regular basis.... there are people in both locations I won't deal with.....

 

I guess there is nothing wrong with selling papers like that as he is being quite blatant about it...

 

You would think that the NBTHK would have something to say as this just invalidates the whole business that they are involved in....

 

Interesting

 

Cheers

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guido Grand Master

Guido

Posted
Posted
... If these are lost (or stolen) NBTHK or NTHK papers, ...

Probably neither nor. Some people don't hand in their old papers when they re-submit a sword for Shinsa for a variety of reasons. Especially when it comes to the old "white papers", the Sinsa fee is the same as if submitted without any previous papers, so there's even no financial gain in delivering the old papers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

Hi Sencho,

 

Yes, I'm also surprised that the NBTHK does nothing to stop this.

 

I've a feeling that at least some of these "loose" papers must be generated when sword owners with old (white and green) NBTHK papers take their blades to be re-evaluated at a modern shinsa. If they obtain a new Hozon or Tokubetsu Hozon origami, why hold on to the old, out-moded one? However, surely it would be a simple matter for the NBTHK to retain the old document when they issue the new one.....thus stopping them from finding their way onto the internet (and then probably onto another sword).

 

Happy New Year!

Simon

(another resident of rainy Kanagawa)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guido Grand Master

Guido

Posted
Posted

Here are the Shinsa fees:

 

Hozon Token

* With no old paper 25,200 Yen

* With Tokubetsu Kicho paper 24,150 Yen

* With Koshu Tokubetsu Kicho paper 22,050 Yen

 

Tokubetsu Hozon Token

* With Hozon paper 52,500 Yen

* With Tokubetsu Kicho paper 47,250 Yen

* With Koshu Tokubetsu Kicho paper 42,000 Yen

 

As one can see, it doesn't cost much to keep the old papers by telling the NBTHK that the sword has no previous papers. For only 1,050 Yen you could keep the old Tokubetsu Kicho papers and get new Hozon papers. Those are then sold for much more on eBay.

 

The NBTHK processes about 1,000 swords at each Shinsa, and simply doesn't have the manpower to check each sword for previous papers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest Simon Rowson

Guest Simon Rowson

Posted
Posted

Point taken Guido, and, to be perfectly honest, I'd probably want to hang onto my old papers as well (especially if I thought my blade might fail the new shinsa and I'd end up with NO papers at all).

 

Regards,

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites
This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one, unless your post is really relevant and adds to the topic..

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...