PNSSHOGUN Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 Hey guys, this is a feature I'm not familiar with and would appreciate some thoughts on school/periods it is commonly seen in. It is mentioned here as being "Ha-Hada", a term I haven't been able to find used frequently. I can provide further photos and details as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryce Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 G'day John, I am not sure if this is the same thing, but these shots are of a mumei shinshinto katana in my collection. It has old NBTHK papers attributing it to Kanenaga from the end of the shinshinto period. I have never been able to find any information about this smith. Cheers, Bryce 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoTanuki yokai Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 From: https://markussesko.com/2015/05/ ha-hada (刃肌): Last but not least I want to introduce the term ha-hada which is used, as the name suggests, to refer to a forging structure that is very visible in the hardened part of the cutting edge, in short in the hamon. The picture below shows a Ko-Hôki blade, a school where you always can expect to see ha-hada. In this context it must be said that the course, border, and/or appearance of the hamon is actually influenced by the “underlying” forging structure. That means a smith just can’t apply any kind of hamon to any kind of jigane, or at least the result will be very difficult to foresee if these two elements are not going hand in hand. The intention behind and control of the smith in the interplay between steel and hardening is actually a highly sophisticated subject and an important factor when it comes to draw conclusions on his skill and (artistic) aim. As mentioned before, it takes a while to comprehend what is natural and unaffected, what is an excellent recreation of naturalness, what is a decent try to do so, and what is just incoherent. And for this you have to hold the blade in hands, that means it is impossible or next to impossible to draw such conclusions on the basis of a few pictures. Also have a look at this but i cant make a list of where one should expect hahada and i also think it is to some degree depending on the polishers work. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PNSSHOGUN Posted March 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 Two more pictures: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisW Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 As expected, its hard to see in the pictures, but I can see some evidence of what you're talking about John! I've seen ha-hada in some blades in person before, but I've never managed to capture it on film (surprise). Upon looking over the photos again, that first one does a really good job of showing it! Bryce's also show it really well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTM72 Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 Like this one? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivkin Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 My take is that if its in good nie, its usually upper grade Soshu. It can be argued that you find it on chokuto etc, but that's too exotic. If its in nioi, you see it being revived by Shimada, and afterwords being used by shinto and shinshinto people. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark S. Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 Not positive if these pics accurately reference what is being discussed, but hope they help. Blade is still awaiting Shinsa, so no verified background info yet. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PNSSHOGUN Posted March 11, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 Thank you all, I appreciate the photos are not ideal but it is extraordinarily difficult to capture it. The activity is interesting in that it is not readily identifiable in the Ji, but only appears within the Hamon. The blade is certainly old, O-Suriage but remains at 28" Nagasa. It has Jizo-Bosho, high Shinogi, Utsuri, and remnants of gold on the Nakago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza Posted March 11, 2022 Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 John, what do you mean by 'high shinogi'?? I take it to mean that taka shinogi is where the shinogi is conspicuously wider/thicker than the mune. This is easuily seen by looking down on the mune. If you mean that the shinogi is unusually close/closer to the mune and the thickness is the same as the mune then that is something else - narrow shinogi ji?? Interesting sword. BaZZa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PNSSHOGUN Posted March 11, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2022 Hi Barry, that is correct, the Shinogi is noticeably wider than the Mune. The sword was purchased more for the provenance, if the blade turns out to be of decent quality that is a bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PNSSHOGUN Posted September 18, 2023 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2023 Some time has passed but Andrew Ickeringill opened a window on this sword. The thought was Oei Bizen Yasumitsu group. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeLuucas Posted September 18, 2023 Report Share Posted September 18, 2023 (edited) Hada shows mostly masame throughout, with a couple spots of mokume. I was told Yamato Tegai by the togishi - but it has not been to shinsa Love this topic, information, and photos. The small spots of mokume on my sword are enjoyable to admire. Edited September 18, 2023 by GeorgeLuucas added: no papers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ooitame Posted September 18, 2023 Report Share Posted September 18, 2023 @PNSSHOGUN Do these pictures represent what you mention? The last picture may show it best, as zoom may have obscured some. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexiG Posted September 19, 2023 Report Share Posted September 19, 2023 Thanks John for resurrecting this. Example if a sword I just sent for the Dec shinsa. Lots of masame (not obvious from images) but mokume by the hamon with strange results. Will update when get results. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Flynn Posted September 19, 2023 Report Share Posted September 19, 2023 Gendai, Nishimura Kanetsune. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2devnul Posted September 19, 2023 Report Share Posted September 19, 2023 Shinsakuto mumei: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardP Posted September 24, 2023 Report Share Posted September 24, 2023 Shimada Yoshisuke (nidai): 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oli Posted February 13 Report Share Posted February 13 Hi, hope its ok to answer an old thread. I also have an example and i hope its match the topic. What do you think about this activities? Regards Oliver 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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