Jump to content

Tosugo ID and tsuba question


BjornLundin
 Share

Recommended Posts

Hi, I bought a bizen (I hope) wakizashi, it came as a koshirae set. With a ill fitting damaged koshirae scabbard and what I am guessing a swapped "low quality" tsuba and kozuka. I am wondering about the other items of the tsuka, quality, school and what is the best way to maintain, clean them. 

 

Any information of the tsuba and koshirae? 

 

More pictures in the next post. 

 

Best Björn

 

 

 

 

 

k1.PNG

k2.PNG

f3.PNG

f1.PNG

f2.PNG

kozuka1.PNG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bjorn

 

Nice blade, I suspect Bizen due to the crab claw choji hamon. (Also part of the mei is Bizen Osafune - I think) leave it to others for translation. The fuchu/kashira are not a matched set IMHO, but I love the Fuchi - reminds me of our current weather, icicles dripping off roof. Tsuba needs lots of TLC. I like the blade. Looks to me like a good, old one.

Rich

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi.

 

I thought the FK was a bit different, the kashira looks to me like pumpkins. Is it ok to try to restore the gold (professionell done) in the pumpkins? 

 

How to clean the kashira and menuki? I thought a bit to use a 100 ul pipette and pipette 80-100% etoh up and down and end with distilled water. 

 

So now need to find a match for either of the FKs. 

 

What to do with the tsuba. Red rust removal by recommended techniques and then try to oxidize black? I dont really think it fits with the shinto 1600? blade. Anyone has any recommendations 👍😀 for tsuba to the blade?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lol, yes. PhD in Molecular Genetics :) been working with plants, bacteria, yeast, algae and humans.

 

Now, I see that I missed the menukis and habaki. I am guessing the habaki is silverfoiled over copper. Would the habaki be ok to clean in in a ultrasound (jeweler) bath or do I destroy the patina? There is a small damage on the habaki, is it ok to try to correct it myself or just leave it.

 

I am foolishly hoping the menuki is gold but reallity tells me it is alloy. 

 

m1.PNG

m2.PNG

h1.PNG

h2.PNG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dear Bjorn.

 

For what it's worth I would not clean the habaki.  I find that the limited oxidation near the base comes from age and is a pleasant indicator that the sword has had the habaki for some time.  If you were to go down the route of shirasaya for this one then of course a new habaki would make sense.  Here is one which illustrates the point.

 

CIMG1103.thumb.JPG.d3580627a917174523c0e579abd6ff25.JPG

 

All the best.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you for all advice 👍 Will keep the nagako as it is. Patina is nice so it is maybe better to just clean very gentle the other parts.

 

 

Bit perplexed of the mismatched FK set. The fushu fits very snug, so I thought it was made to fit. Is it common to have a mismatch FK set made? The tsuka looks to have some age to it. So it may been assembled in the 1800th or earlier. My guess.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well that's a question I had never thought to ask, Rich.  Thinking about it now I suppose I have always associated it with quite late koshirae, certainly the few I have seen have been relatively late Edo period.

 

Interested to know what others think about that.

 

All the best.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bjorn-

I don’t think you get much satisfaction using ETOH for cleaning. My experience suggests you could probably extract DNA from old pieces! I have used surfactants with much better results and they won’t affect patina either. There are various strengths of ultrasound and I haven’t had much luck with low strength units used for jewelry. On the other hand these low powered units haven’t removed any uttori either. In some cases I’ve used bamboo toothpicks to soften the grime but you have to be careful. Menuki weren’t often made of brass so they could either be gold or fire-gilded. In either case they should clean up nicely. Look underneath the ito to see the original color. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, BjornLundin said:

Thank you for all advice 👍 Will keep the nagako as it is. Patina is nice so it is maybe better to just clean very gentle the other parts.

 

 

Bit perplexed of the mismatched FK set. The fushu fits very snug, so I thought it was made to fit. Is it common to have a mismatch FK set made? The tsuka looks to have some age to it. So it may been assembled in the 1800th or earlier. My guess.

Björn,

try to resist the urge to 'restore' parts of your nice sword! You will not improve but damage it and its value. Cleaning with a soft brush is o.k., but not more! The NAKAGO (not Nagako) is not cleaned unless there is active red rust. 
What you feel not to be a good match might be seen differently by Japanese. The FUCHI (not Fushu) is interesting, but may be a later item. The KASHIRA is well made and deserves more study, I think.

P.S. TOSOGU !

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jean, I hear you. 

 

I will resist.

 

For the tsuba, what is recommended as TLC? Active rust removal with horn or other hard but soft material and then efter that I am clueless. Until now I have given it some oil. Same oil as I use for the blades. There are some chemicals that can be used to oxidize black but that feels a bit to cheat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Björn,

the use of modern chemicals will cause effects on metallic surfaces that differ from what the Japanese craftsmen intended. It is not so much about cheating but damaging the item and making it look unnatural. In some cases, patina builds up slowly under natural conditions, and there are no shortcuts that have the same results.

TLC means to use methods and materials that cause no damage. A toothbrush, horn, bone or antler, perhaps a small amount of oil which is then wiped off - together with patience that should do.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jean how is your Swedish? Bjorn is doing well enough with his translations to get his message out. 

Bjorn the tsuba looks in overall good shape you can remove the rust with bone, antler or ivory [old piano key] if the colour worries you a relatively easy method is to heat the iron just enough to be too hot to hold in the hand and using a soft cotton cloth rub gently - now if you want chemicals use some saliva on the cloth, The ptyalin in the saliva reacts with the metal to darken the iron - its natural always with you and causes no harm. I am also sure that the Japanese likely used the same technique but it's not talked about [you know tsuba has at least three meanings?  Guard, Brim and Saliva - there is probably a clue there.] The fuchi would likely match a tsuba featuring a honeypot like these from the Museum of Applied Arts & Sciences [Powerhouse Museum, Sydney Australia] (A5308-58) (A5308--111)

image.thumb.png.8b6986f65712155fa8412b93335bcb51.png

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shojo (Xingxing, written as 猩猩 or 猩々) is an imaginary animal first appeared in Chinese legends.
As other members say, even timeless dullness and dirt are part of the value. For example, the treatment of historic guns that have been re-polished and re-blued is not always correct.


https://www.jauce.com/auction/w407148924

 

 

Lefaucheux Pinfire Revolver made by Solingen.jpg

酒甕に猩々図鍔.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one, unless your post is really relevant and adds to the topic..

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...