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Shin gunto opinions


fireguyfire

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Hi there; new to the forum ww2 collector who knows a very little bit about ww2 Japanese swords.

At one point I owned a Kai Gunto but sold it  to fund the purchase of something else and have regretted it ever since.

ive been casually looking for another ww2 sword and through a friend of the family was offered this sword the other day. The elderly lady who owns it says it was her husbands, and the sword was a vet bring back by his uncle, who lived in the eastern US (the sword is now in western Canada).

she came across the sword while cleaning out the barn and was kind enough to send these photos.

I am getting a hands on in a few days but for now these photos are all I have and I was hoping to get some input from collectors that know a lot more than I do so that I can decide to pursue it or not.

As you can see the handle is in poor condition, but the fittings are there with the exception of 1 of the cherry blossoms for the handle.

The scabbard has a leather field cover which is great; it appears to be in good shape from the photos.

From the books I have I’m guessing it’s a mid war sword because it only has 1 scabbard hanger and has a non pierced tsuba. 
She says the blade looks very good but is covered with a thick sticky substance; she says there is no rust and offered to clean the blade but I told her to leave it as is.

She has very little attachment to the sword and I think it could be had for a very reasonable price. 
I am open to comments about the sword, and also suggestions on what to do with it if I do get it regarding restoring the handle, etc.

Thanks in advance for your inputs!

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Hi Todd, to be quite frank....this is a big project piece, what price is she asking? Straight away you would looking at buying a replacement original Tsuka (about 100-200usd for a nice one), finding one that will fit could be tricky as well. As for the blade....it looks pretty rough but that may just be old cosmoline. If the price is right and the blade is old or signed it could be a fun little project.

 

Do not, under and circumstances, use any sort of abrasive material or cleaning solution to clean the blade!

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Thanks for the reply; I definitely would never use an abrasive if I do acquire the sword.

is the tsuka unsaveable? I was thinking perhaps a careful cleaning of the Ray skin and then having it re wrapped might be enough to make it a presentable representation of an honest ww2 field sword.

I’ll know much more when I get an in person look in a few days and will post up better I do then.

im guessing I could get it in the $300-$400 range and I don’t think I could go wrong at that price level.

I’m assuming the mountings are nothing special?

Does a leather cover add value or just appeal?

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 All the bits are there, though the tsuka is missing Ito and is broken near the end. Nothing that cannot be put right though.... What I do like is that it still has it's sarute which is rare, and a nice one of those runs at up to £50 to £100 in the UK on it's own.

As the shogun says, it all depends on the asking price.

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It depends if you are a "fixer-uper" kind of guy, or just want a nice gunto for your collection.  Dave can get you connected to some guys that can do the re-wrap.  There are various places you can buy menugi for the tsuka (handle).  Search this site for "cosmoline removal" and you'll get several discussion.  All in all, a fairly do-able project, and you'll still come in under the price of an intact Type 98 on the market.

 

The leather covered saya is the "combat saya" or "informal saya".  Value varies with each collector, but they sell in the same price range as gunto with metal saya.  Like John indicated, it could mean there's an old family blade inside.  Family blades brought to the war were often re-fitted with the leather-covered saya.  Need to get that mekugi (pin) out of the tsuka and take some pictures of the nakago (tang).  It might be signed, it might be old.

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This is precisely the type of sword which is a excellent candidate for at least a modest restoration! The fittings are in good condition, the saya appears in fairly decent, the blade appears to be ok, albeit the cosmoline. Tsuka will need reconstruction.( Possibly David McDonald or Fred Loman on Tsuka.)  However, as others have mentioned, proceed cautiously!! Love to see it when completed should you decide to restore!

 

Dave M.

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Just one further comment...You can purchase a more age appropriate tsuka on ebay, however, they won't be the original fittings and they will never fit your nakago properly. Should you decide to restore the tsuka, I would also highly suggest requesting a darker same' as pictured above on account of a new pure white same' would not look right with the overall age of your gunto..

 

Good luck,

 

Dave M.

 

 

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Thanks for the replies gents, and thanks for the photo Dave; that would be exactly my hoped result if I indeed wind up with it.

I restore a lot of things as a hobby, from old cars and trucks to gas pumps and coke machines, and I have a fully outfitted wood shop on my acreage as well so I am more than game to tackle the restoration of this sword, however with most specialty things there would be lots of advice and tips needed as the last thing I would want to do is create unnecessary damage to a historical item because of my ignorance.

I know we aren’t supposed to talk valuations on this part of the forum, but I’m thinking if I could get it for 3 or 400 dollars I would still be fine.

please let me know if I am off base on that gents.

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One more thing I notice looking at the photos is that it appears to have a normal steel says inside of the leather cover; is that unusual?

The leather says cover definitely appears to be original, and I see a leather snap on the sword itself so I’m assuming g the sword and saya have always been together.

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54 minutes ago, fireguyfire said:

One more thing I notice looking at the photos is that it appears to have a normal steel says inside of the leather cover; is that unusual?

The leather says cover definitely appears to be original, and I see a leather snap on the sword itself so I’m assuming g the sword and saya have always been together.

 

58 minutes ago, fireguyfire said:

Thanks for the replies gents, and thanks for the photo Dave; that would be exactly my hoped result if I indeed wind up with it.

I restore a lot of things as a hobby, from old cars and trucks to gas pumps and coke machines, and I have a fully outfitted wood shop on my acreage as well so I am more than game to tackle the restoration of this sword, however with most specialty things there would be lots of advice and tips needed as the last thing I would want to do is create unnecessary damage to a historical item because of my ignorance.

I know we aren’t supposed to talk valuations on this part of the forum, but I’m thinking if I could get it for 3 or 400 dollars I would still be fine.

please let me know if I am off base on that gents.

 

$400 would be fine, $300 even better. Plenty of people on the board to advise with proper restoration!

Nothing unusual about the gunto saya beneath the leather, actually a good thing in my opinion.

Dave M.

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Oh, I didn’t see that metal under the leather. Thanks for pointing that out! So, disregard my point about the blade being old. It still could be, but the odds are, now, that it’s a war era blade.  But it could be either, and seeing the Nakago is the only way to tell.

 

I see prices around the $600 range for something like this. So if you got it for 3-400, you’re doing well.

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