Help with Stamp Kanji, Please!

[Bruce Pennington]

A mind is a terrible thing to waste!  Sorry if I've posted this one before, but I don't remember asking for help on this one yet.

 

The stamp was poorly struck, so there's some strokes missing.  Any idea of the meaning?

Thanks!

[Shugyosha]

Sorry Bruce I only know a couple of stamps. Looks the “Nishi” kanji, meaning “west”, enclosed in a circle.  Does that make any sense? 

[Bruce Pennington]

I think you nailed it! 

西

Might be a regional mark.  Not sure if if would make sense as a personal hot stamp.

[george trotter]

Yes, Nishi. Probably an inspection/production mark. I had a look through the 'Nihon Token Shoko Meikan' of 1942  (edit/addition since first post) and saw a half dozen Nishi-something names but only one person with the name NISHI alone. He was in Osaka and listed as a togishi (polisher)...he's on page 277 . His personal fore-name is Hiroshi. Not saying this is the guy who stamped the 'nishi' mark on the tang, but he does fit the circumstances, a polisher named Nishi, puts his "company" mark on  the tang of a sword he has just finished polishing....?

Maybe if you tell us the blade maker name / location etc we could get a bit more of a clue?

Regards,

[Bruce Pennington]

20 hours ago, george trotter said:

Yes, Nishi. Probably an inspection/production mark. I had a look through the 'Nihon Token Shoko Meikan' of 1942  (edit/addition since first post) and saw a half dozen Nishi-something names but only one person with the name NISHI alone. He was in Osaka and listed as a togishi (polisher)...he's on page 277 . His personal fore-name is Hiroshi. Not saying this is the guy who stamped the 'nishi' mark on the tang, but he does fit the circumstances, a polisher named Nishi, puts his "company" mark on  the tang of a sword he has just finished polishing....?

Maybe if you tell us the blade maker name / location etc we could get a bit more of a clue?

Regards,

George, quite an interesting idea - a polisher's mark!  I've seen polishers with a kao, so why not a stamp?!  Thanks for doing some digging on this!

 

Sorry to say it was one of the early stamps posted on the Arsenal Stamps thread back in 2010 by GregD, on Page 2.

 

I just sent him a PM, but he hasn't been active for a year and a half.

[george trotter]

I had a look at  that page 2 and  if that stamp  he shows is on the sword he shows above it .....then it  is  on a tang by Seki Yoshinao, so can't? be Mr Nishi of Osaka.

If it is on the tang below it, by Izumo ju Tsukimune saku - don't know if I have traanslated it right -  (Izumo is Shimane Pref.)...then this too cannot be Mr Nishi.

BUT it is always possible that sword production from nearby prefectures to Osaka would be collected and polished in Osaka...just don't know.

 

I suppose this reinforces the old Japanese sword collecting / studying law...we mustn't make assumptions.

Back to square one?

[Kiipu]

The complete stamp should look like the image below.

[Bruce Pennington]

With George's suggestion that it's a polisher's stamp, I'm starting to wonder if all the similar unidentified odd-ball stamps at the end of the nakago are in the same boat.

 

The marks at the nakago jiri, seems to me, to be from someone else other than the smith.  "M", fitting numbers, etc, appear here and are not part of the mei.  So, it would be logical to think of these as polishers' marks or maybe a fitting shop emblem.

[george trotter]

You might have something there Bruce.... does pic 1 look like the logo on this 1942 advert for the Suya Sword Shop in  Tokyo? (p.90 Dai Hihon Token Shoko Meikan 1942 ).

This shop, which has run since Meiji times,  supplies (manufactures?) everything for army and navy swords...fitings etc to swords... mountings (I can't see it specifically mentioned, but maybe polishing also?).

Maybe one of our fluent folk can comment.

Anyway, maybe this #i pic is this mark, which may mean that those other marks are from similar supply shops?

Regards, 

[Bruce Pennington]

9 hours ago, george trotter said:

does pic 1 look like the logo on this 1942 advert for the Suya Sword Shop

I don't know, George.  And actually, now that I'm staring at them again, I remember that both #1 & 3 are the same stamp (different blades).  Someone had earlier identified the symbol as the "flaming jewel."  But significance unknown.

 

But I've put them together for a better look.

[george trotter]

Hi Bruce...yes looks more like the flaming jewel...oh well...maybe one day we'll work it out.

Regards,

[Kiipu]

See this recent article for a complete image of the flaming pot/jewel symbol.  This symbol only seems to show up from this group of smiths?

Amahide & Seki Nihonto Tanren Jo

 

The source of the two illustrations above can be found below.

north china railway winged wheel stamp