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New member with an old katana


Steve D
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Hi

I'm a new member and have been given an old sword that my late father acquired many years ago.

I'm trying to find out some info on it but not sure where to start.

It's not in very good condition unfortunately and the chord and handle are in bits and the blade is very rusty. 

There are no marking that I can see on the tang but there are markings around the collar. 

As I was trying to remove the handle the chords fell apart but I did notice that there were pieces of paper under the chord which, I believe, helps with the wrapping of the handle.

I was hoping someone may be able to help with any info on it.

 

Thanks

Steve

 

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8 minutes ago, SAS said:

Condition is poor but there may be a lot of potential there.....the habaki is quite fancy, which usually indicates a good sword. More knowledgeable people will comment soon, I am sure.

Yeah, it's not in great condition. Still very sharp though..

 

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Hi Steve,

 

Welcome to NMB. I don't think that you're going to get a lot of help from the pictures you have posted: if you are able to post a picture of the whole blade with the guard and habaki off that would help and maybe close-ups of the point and any detail visible along the blade you are more likely to get some comments.

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9 minutes ago, Shugyosha said:

Hi Steve,

 

Welcome to NMB. I don't think that you're going to get a lot of help from the pictures you have posted: if you are able to post a picture of the whole blade with the guard and habaki off that would help and maybe close-ups of the point and any detail visible along the blade you are more likely to get some comments.

Thanks for the advice. I'll post some more pictures later. 

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Dear Steve.

 

There are one or two of us not too far from you , it may be that someone will offer to look at the sword in hand which would be ideal.  The handle was wrapped in a very stylish way before it fell to pieces, look after all the bits and see what we can make of it.

 

Above all do not try to clean it up without guidance from someone who knows what they are doing.

 

Looking forward to seeing how this develops with some more pictures.

 

All the best.

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10 minutes ago, Nobody said:

二龍争玉 – Two dragons fighting for a gem

 

松間月? – Shokangetsu? (an art name?) – The Moon through pine needles

I’m not sure about “”.

Thank you. I've been trying to look through Japanese figures.

Here's another pic (with an 1810 du Klingenthal French Napoleonic sword also in the garage):

 

20200811_144153.jpg

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1 hour ago, Geraint said:

Dear Steve.

 

There are one or two of us not too far from you , it may be that someone will offer to look at the sword in hand which would be ideal.  The handle was wrapped in a very stylish way before it fell to pieces, look after all the bits and see what we can make of it.

 

Above all do not try to clean it up without guidance from someone who knows what they are doing.

 

Looking forward to seeing how this develops with some more pictures.

 

All the best.

Would be great to get some who knows what they are looking at to have a look. 

I'm not planning to try and do any restoration myself as I wouldn't know where to start..

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Is that a tiny part of a Fairbairn Sykes dagger I see in the one pic? 🙂
As mentioned, the wrap and some other details of this sword means it needs to be checked out properly. It looks very interesting.
Press out the wooden peg in the handle and the handle will slide off showing the tang, which will tell us a lot.

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3 minutes ago, Brian said:

Is that a tiny part of a Fairbairn Sykes dagger I see in the one pic? 🙂
As mentioned, the wrap and some other details of this sword means it needs to be checked out properly. It looks very interesting.
Press out the wooden peg in the handle and the handle will slide off showing the tang, which will tell us a lot.

Don't have any daggers unfortunately..

I've removed the handle as the chord just fell to pieces but cannot see any markings on the tang. I don't want to try running any rust off just yet...

 

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You can wipe off any loose rust with a soft cloth, and gently wipe until no more rust comes off. But use NOTHING abrasive and don't clean the tang any more than that. Some light oil with a cloth will stabilize the rust.
I thought I saw the FS here...no worries 🙂

rgrfe.jpg

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1 hour ago, Nobody said:

二龍争玉 – Two dragons fighting for a gem

 

松間月? – Shokangetsu? (an art name?) – The Moon through pine needles

I’m not sure about “”.

 

Hi,


二龍争玉松間月
Ni ryu tama o arasou sho-kan no tsuki.

 

Meaning is:
The Moon between two pine trees looks like Two dragons fighting for a gem.

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The Ito that's come undone was jabbara I think which is more decorative than a functional wrap. 

As you can see it's not very durable. 

Even though rusty if it's all on the surface it might be salvageable by a good polisher. 

 

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That is really, really sad that it got into that condition. It would take a good polisher if it can be saved, But the shape hints at something good. Get it to a good polisher and ask his opinion and to open a window. It may be worth it. Get it well oiled asap. NO abrasives.

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I think when offers are made the owner almost always starts to think the offers are ridiculously low and becomes suspicious.In that condition what is it worth,as there is no value to the fittings they are incomplete or way beyond saving. The blades a huge gamble I've honestly never seen a sword that badly corroded.I think it possible the polisher would hit core steel in any attempt to salvage.

Not to mention any kizu hiding beneath that rust so in the interests of curiousity and as it's in the UK.

What £150, £250? £450..... more??

If you saw that swords twin at a car boot sale or auction house I mean

 

 

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Personally, I think that sugata looks extremely promising. If I were you, I’d do as Brian says. Take it to a member near you for expertise and if he thinks it is salvageable (I believe it is), then you may have something of value here.

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Only person that could possibly give an opinion on whether it was salvageable is a Togoshi. Even the best intended kantei on sugata alone is really really stretching the bounds of reality. 

Like I said you have no idea what's under all that well established and apparently still active rust. 

The OP has no funds to restore this blade, I've asked. This is not a loved blade, caringly handed down, this is a neglected blade (no offence) that sat in a shed or garage left rusting until someone new has come into possession of. Its that "what is it" and then "what's it worth" scenario whatever way you look at it. 

So realistically a polish £ £1000-2000?

New koshirae or restoration of whatever is left £800-1000? 

No idea if its going to even be worth the Polish (even if the sugata is nice) 

No offence and no attack I'm just curios where the "it's salvageable" opinions are coming from based on those images. 

Its at best a flip of a coin surely? 

Please correct me if you feel I'm wrong. 

I want to learn. 

 

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This is how good swords are found. Someone cannot afford a full polish? no problem...get it evaluated and a window done. Then you know if it's worth $250 or $1000. Then it goes to the next owner who does get it polished. Sometimes whether it is worth it is irrelevant.
Bunch of people who will be offering 100 bucks because of the condition and the fact that "it's a gamble" is why this hobby is full of sharks. Yeah, maybe it's burned and has no hamon. Or maybe it is pitted to hell and had no boshi. The OP should try and find out as much as he can so he can make an educated guess as to value.

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Sure but only a togoshi can help as stated.

I did offer when the owner said he didn't have the money to polish it. I won't lie $650,but only as I've one slot this month with our polisher.one of my other swords was considered not worth the polish.

Nice naginata Naoshi wide blade. clean blade, really prominent hada of masame. No hamon at all and no obvious exposure to heat.just nothing there any more.

I paid $400 for that. Still it's a decent steel Tsunagi.

Was my offer cheeky??

I've since reconsidered and instead bought a koto and a muramachi katana.

I think I only made that offer because I didn't want it forsaken any more than it has. No offense OP.

 

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And here was me thinking only I must be that mad with that offer Jean Pierre.😊 

I'll be honest my grasp of swords is not very developed.I cannot see through that rust at all.

I only have four swords nowadays including the two new katana but not the naginata Naoshi. I'm more inclined towards the fittings.

My only idiosyncrasies are I don't buy into flawed swords.I prefer flamboyant hamon, my koto kat is Suguba though .If it's got good mounts great,if not I've got plenty of quality period spares to go around.

I wish someone would restore this sword if it's recoverable though.

 

 

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Looks like this sword is causing some discussion 🙂

I'm completely new to swords and am learning new words and descriptions for things I didn't even know existed,  it's great! 

My initial reason for posting was to get some info on the sword as I didn't have a clue where to start. 

The more I'm learning the more I want to know about this sword.

 

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This thread is quite old. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one, unless your post is really relevant and adds to the topic..

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