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Bazza

UNUSUAL DAGGER - MADE IN Japan FOR CHINA?

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 On collectors forums for other ethnic weapons and militaria weird stuff turns up all the time! A decent amount of it often turns out to be tourist stuff. Sometimes it turns out, as with a lot of African stuff, that the original makers made no differentiation, and a tourist bought an authentic piece, and sometimes also with African stuff it's complete Brumagem in the truest sense of the word.... In one case it turned out to be a fantasy art piece made by a well known artist. All good fun, and a learning experience for all of us.

 

  On balance I think it's a tourist piece as well, made for those with too little capacity for a full sword... those ruddy CB's and Aussies!

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Wow , so there are at least another 187529 other pieces of crap like this out there somewhere . I agree with Hamish 100% . Don't know why I am even giving this junk any time at all .

Ian Brooks

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I'm with the post war Japanese tourist trade faction. Definitely not a repurposed bayonet, even though marked with Nagoya stamp. (Possibly stamped in memory of better times). Fittings appear fairly decent, (We've all seen much worse). The ito wrap is seriously ugly.

 

Not sure why some find the item so offensive. If it had a nice black same', decent silk ito with appropriate menuki professionally wrapped and crafted it would be something I wouldn't mind owning as a novelty.

 

Merely an opinion,

 

Fire away if inclined,

 

Dave M.

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Question, if it's such uninteresting crap (and we have established that it's not a genuine piece) why go to the effort of commenting?

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So what? Maybe it’s a tourist trinket, maybe it’s a genuine never recorded item, maybe it’s a bubba job, who cares? Thing is still better looking than most repro junk around and not uninteresting since it challenges our knowledge.

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I'll pipe up again,

 

If anyone thinks this resembles anything antique or slightly genuine.

They are uneducated in the area of imperial Japanese swords. Fullllllllllstop.

 

Stop looking in books and handle a couple of thousand IJ swords, and you will understand why certain members can spot this a mile away and can comment on it with 150% certainty.

 

It's not evan close to a tourist piece either. It is just plain simple modern s**t.

 

The uniform machining press marked area should be a massive give away.

Can we please discus something with merit, because to continue this topic only muddied the waters for those learning.

 

Gone are the days of finding unpublished models

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Hamish,
You are allowed your opinion, even allowed to claim it is junk. All the better when you substantiate why you say that.
But you are NOT allowed to insult members and make claims about their knowledge. I think you owe people an apology for that. We have guys with years of experience, and they are allowed to state their opinion and discuss it as much as they like.Since most of those guys know far more than me about Japanese militaria, calling them uneducated is calling me uneducated. You know if you don't like the item or the discussion, participation in that thread is optional.
We are all under stress, but I think you owe some an apology.

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While the comments from Hamish are harsh it is a little disturbing to see so much conversation on this when there are many other more interesting and enlightening topics available here.

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Hamfish & John 

Sorry that you get eye cancer and angry of this. But this piece is in my eyes not a replica or fake. Its a scratch made knife or dagger with relations to Japan military. Asian made or a Japanese tourist after war piece. But not as bad as mostly fakes and useable. Overall i didn't found it really bad  :) and with some care it would look nice. It looks much better than most of the island made crude swords which are in my eyes total ugly.

And if you compare the different "serial" numbers on the link, you see that someone had made more then one of this.

I can live with the statement that i'm not very educated and often stupid in answers and questions but i try learn every day a little bid more. :thumbsup:

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Im never one to deliberately offend any person, and my last post wasn't done to provoke or insult. It just was poorly worded.

 

But I'm not sure there's any apologising needed, if any member is happy to spend there money on such items. Go for it, it's there learning curve.

 

I think I can back my knowledge, by stating I have owned a few items published in to both Fuller&Gregory books. Ok I'm not knowledgeable on nihonto or tsuba, but I can back my opinion on military mounts and sword models with cash donations

 

I know Bazza personally, so hes ok with my opinion. But lets say I'm wrong and it can be proved I'll donate the value of the alleged item to the board as a penance

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And don’t worry about me Hamish, I’m not the kind that gets angry or anything about such trifle. I guess everyone is entitled about their opinion. Some voice it strongly others less but it doesn’t matter.

 

Besides, you are right, I’m probably very uneducated compared to you so no offense taken.

 

Nevertheless, I don’t see what’s wrong with talking about this item, whatever it is. It is obviously intriguing enough to warrant so much discussion. I too believe, like Chris, it’s a tourist piece, the WW2 equivalent of those Meiji bone handled tanto. So if if I’m wrong and you’re right, what’s the deal, it was still an interesting discussion.

 

Take care and be sure there’s no ill feelings, at least from my part!  :beer:

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Hamish, you are mistaking what you are saying, with how you are saying it.
My opinion is the same as yours. But I don't accuse anyone who thinks otherwise of being uneducated or imply they are stupid. You need to express your opinion without involving others or making commentary about their knowledge.

I won't tolerate blatant insults, and the fact that you may know a member or a few, does not condone comments like that.

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Once again there was no malice in my posts.

 

If you want to slap my knuckles, ban me for a month.

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See - we really ARE like family! HA! Arguing like two kids in the back seat of a car on a long trip. "MOM, BILLY TOUCHED ME!"..."WELL SHE'S CROWDING ONTO MY HALF OF THE CAR!" ..."MOM, HE DID IT AGAIN!"

 

Just shows we're human. What I DO like is that we stick it out and resolve stuff. Thanks Hamish for your hearing the other guys.

 

 

This discussion is another case showing the differences in different people's interests. "One man's trash - another man's treasure". That's all this is.

 

I know I'm going to wear this out, but I love it!!!:

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Transfering from the Short Gunto thread: Matt just found a tanto in military fittings that has striking resemblance to these daggers. The tanto is clearly legit, and in comparison, shows how these are not, but I can't help but think that maybe this is what the craftman had in mind when making the daggers.

 

(post #40, here: http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/32030-short-gunto/page-2)

 

Note that the maker used a kabutogane for a sayajiri. So there is precedent for using the "wrong" parts on gunto that are legit, though these still go too far by mixing navy and army parts.

post-3487-0-24314400-1591193369_thumb.jpg

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