Shinsakuto for Iaido

[Matt D]

I'm a new member of this site and a student of iaido. One day I'd like to purchase a Nihonto, but commissioning a new sword may be too costly. I also don't want to use an antique, even a relatively inexpensive one. But I figure there might be some value in preowned modern swords made fairly recently.

 

Is there a decent market out there for preowned Nihonto made during the last 30 years or so?

 

Where would you recommend that I look?

 

Thank you in advance for any information and advice.

 

Matt D.

[ROKUJURO]

Matt,

you probably mean a SHINSAKUTO? If it was made in the last 30 years, this would also mean GENDAITO. There are many possibilities if you look in the internet (with the right terms!). All depends on how much you want to spend. . 

[Katsujinken]

Jean is correct! In Japan, everyone using a shinken is using a traditionally made sword (supposedly...). Swords intended for iai and tameshigiri are often made with lower grade tamahagane or lack a fancy polish, etc., because they are bound to take some abuse. Here are some examples: https://www.e-sword.jp/category/iai/

 

¥350,000 is going to be the starting point for a decent shinsakuto not intended as an art sword. That may or may not include koshirae or the koshirae may or may not be suitable for iai. You'll definitely want to do your research and get an experienced practitioner who is familiar with nihonto to help you, when and if the time comes.

[Ken-Hawaii]

Matt, no, not everyone who is using a shinken (live blade) is using a shinsakuto, which will eventually turn into an antique art sword.

 

First, has your sensei allowed shinken in the dojo? I have more than 30 years of iaido/iaijutsu experience, & I've only had one Sensei who allowed them. Please ask to be certain.

 

Second, do you specifically have permission to use anything except an iaito?

 

Third, please don't consider using any hand-made blade in your martial arts training. You'll notice that this forum is dedicated to the preservation genuine Japanese swords, & since you're not fighting battles for the Shogun or your Daimyo, then there's no reason to use a Nihonto, or even a Showato or Gendaito.

 

Buy a shinken from Cold Steel for tameshigiri. Mine has worked very well for decades, & I teach tameshigiri for several local Sensei.

 

Welcome to NMB.

[Matt D]

Thank you everyone for your responses.  And sorry for the typo in Subject line.  I did mean to say shinsakuto.

 

Regarding Ken's comment, I am a relatively new student and will be practicing with an iaito for quite some time.  When the time comes for shinken, I don't plan to use a real Nihonto to practice Tameshigiri.  Nevertheless, I hope to one day own one, even if it's not considered an art sword (yet).

 

Other than E-Sword, are there any other trusted sources you would recommend if I want to just look for now? 

 

Thank you again for your help.

[Ken-Hawaii]

You're in the right place on NMB, Matt. Just add your first name in your Profile, & you'll see Japanese swords of every description. Check out the For Sale threads for blades you can depend on as shoshin (real).

 

If I may ask, which iaido ryuha do you train in? I've trained the longest in Muso Jikiden Eishin-Ryu, but will go back to Shinto-Ryu iaijutsu when the pandemic allows.

[jeremy]

You may also want to try Rick Polland at swordstore.com

They have steel iaito which use Japanese fittings and the blades made in China. The feel is almost identical to shinsakuto, from the tsuka to the blade .

[Matt D]

Ken, 

 

For about a year I studied a Koryu art, but I'd rather not mention the name because there was an unfortunate split in the organization.  More recently, we've been studying Toyama and Nakamura Ryu.  I'm open to studying a more traditional iaido, but there are limited choices in the states. 

[jeremy]

Welcome to the toyama and nakamura ryu family sir.

Jeremy

[Jean]

Corrected the title typo

[16k]

Okay, so I’m going to be the one who says Komonjo, then.

 

shady dealer, shady provenance, but excellent bare blades at a very low price. Though, of course, you’ll need to have a Habaki and koshirae made which will add to the cost.

 

though with the lock down, he doesn’t have any of the cheap ones at the moment.

[Greg F]

Hi Matt

Welcome go Nmb. I really hope you take Ken's advice and never use Nihonto. In my opinion a westerner using Nihonto is selfish and stupidity. Giheiya is another shop like e-sword but if you buy Nihonto please do it for study and preservation and use a modern repro for iaido or an iaito. I use both iaito and well made chinese repro.

 

Greg

[waljamada]

Perhaps look for a not so pretty polish mantetsu blade? Made during ww2 period and known as good cutters plus can be found at a decent price. Bruce Pennington has one for sale right now. Not sure if mantetsus are also no nos for using as practicing cutters.

[Ken-Hawaii]

Adam, I'm sticking with my advice not to use any blade but a modern shinken, assuming you're cleared by your sensei for something sharper than an iaito.

[Matt D]

There seems to be two viewpoints on this issue.  Some would say that there's nothing wrong with using a recent and somewhat plain Nihonto for iaido practice.  Others would argue that every Nihonto is irreplaceable work of art and thus should be preserved.

 

After further thought, I don't think I'd want to subject any Nihonto to the wear and tear and potential damage from iaido practice.

 

Matt D.

[jeremy]

Hi Matt

 

I think you'll find also Japanese iaido and particularly tameshigiri practitioners may have differing views on this subject . In Japan many of my teachers use cheap modern made shinsakuto for their cutting and iaido training . In rough dull cutting polish . In the West we are more spoilt for choice, in Japan only Japanese nihonto are allowed to be sold etc. If you want one of the closest things to a shinsakuto i would contact Rick Polland at swordstore.com and ask about his steel iaito. They cost about $1500usd. Cheaper than shinsakuto and just as good for cutting and iaido .

Cheers

Jeremy