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Two KaiGunto for review

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Hi everyone,

 

I'm currently looking to add one kaiGunto to my collection.

 

From a trusted contact that I know I received photo's of these two swords and I would like to own one. My instinct is telling me that the one with the two hangers(ashi) is correct and it 'speaks' to me more. It also has matching numbers.

 

I've also read some worrying things about the single ashi version lately.

 

 

post-5015-0-81280700-1570556665_thumb.jpg

 

 

#Sword 1 - Single ashi

post-5015-0-18427200-1570555770_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-79918800-1570555782_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-70976300-1570555796_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-23453700-1570555844_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-12961700-1570555855_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-34990300-1570555864_thumb.jpg

 

 

#sword 2 - Double ashi

post-5015-0-06796300-1570555889_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-29084300-1570555899_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-40715500-1570555906_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-75830600-1570555914_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-34048000-1570555922_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-52197400-1570555928_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-37607800-1570555936_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-66691500-1570555943_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-47465100-1570555956_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-76013200-1570555963_thumb.jpg

 

Which one would you choose?

 

Thanks everyone!

 

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I would get the more complete one, too, if the price is right. They are both showato, and Kai Gunto, but are great choices!

 

The one with one ashi is an original and correct Kai-Gunto, just missing one. It has a tassel, so depending on the price, that may be a good one too. I think the 2nd may be the best choice, however.

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Hi Lev,

 

Thank you for your opinion. 

 

I'm also thinking the 2nd one is the better choice with the cord tassel loop(i've read these usually came on higher end fittings), and the shagreen saya which I like. A tassel could be a 'upgrade' for the future, not sure about that.

 

However, the price for each blade is 1650 euro, 1800 USD.

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Dear David,

 

You realise that both are rustless steel I'm sure.  (Either that or Number 1 has had some serious recent work done to it.)   As already suggested I would go with number 2 if you want to jump on these but the price seems a little high to me, any room for negotiation?

 

All the best.

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Unusual signature on the first one, I'd be interested to see what it says.

 

Second one has the Tenshozan factory stamp.

 

Both are nice, but I'd go for the second, unless the smith on the first is someone special.

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It says 天照山 Tanshozan  乙 Otsu on the tang. I guess it was made in 天照山鍛煉場Tanshozan Forgin workshop ?They made alot of Kai Gunto.

 

post-3887-0-69692000-1570565664_thumb.jpg

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Thanks everyone. And you beat me to it Trystan, the moment I posted a translation request you gave it here ;)

 

I'm still opting for the second sword. Only got a fraction of the price to 1600 euro, it's something. These prices, even for the 'rustfree steel' machinemade blades are going up like crazy.. Yesterday I saw one in worse condition than these for 4500 euro.... my jaw dropped since it was most likely machine made. 

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#sword 2 - Double ashi

The second sword appears to have a Toyokawa Naval Arsenal 豊川海軍工廠 logo.  Toyokawa Naval Arsenal was officially opened in December 1939.  Not sure if this stamp appears in the Arsenal Stamps thread or not.

Edited by Thomas
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There were two anchors - Toyokawa and Tenshozan. Toyokawa was the arsenal and had a simple anchor. Tenshozan was a company and had a more elaborate anchor:

 

Toyokawa

post-3487-0-47569900-1570579802_thumb.jpg

 

Tenshozan

post-3487-0-60725200-1570579953_thumb.jpg

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Hi David , my gut feeling is that at 1600 euro the piece is overpriced . I think if you take your time and look around you will wind up with something much better for this sort of money .

Ian Brooks

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Nothing too disturbing about the first one, looks like a later war example. The tassel is a nice addition and the blade is more desirable. Otherwise they are pretty standard Kai Gunto with nothing extraordinary about them, especially considering the price.

 

Both of them for around $2200 would be reasonable, but there are plenty of equally nice or nicer examples for that sort of money on the market regularly.

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David H, if you want a pretty good one about US1100, including postage send me a message. It is not stainless steel but a Naotane made blade. 

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David H, if you want a pretty good one about US1100, including postage send me a message. It is not stainless steel but a Naotane made blade.

 

Dang Neil!!! I wish I had met you before I bought my kai (at $2,400)!!!

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The very last photo sure looks like my Kai Gunto Incognito!  The Oseppas appear to be steel, and the tsuba looks to be plated. It also is missing the middle seppas, which Neil pointed out as pure Navy.  Maybe those steel seppas aren't so rare after all.  Late war, or mixed post-war?  

 

Buy them both, if you can afford it!

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Well spotted Austus, I didn't notice the 'missing' middle seppas. But the tsuba doesn't look to be lose, maybe the middle seppas simply weren't needed?

 

Anyway, I am PM'ing with Neil and I'm still in the market for the second sword in this topic.

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Sounds like the one that Neil has is a bargain; and he only handles the best of specimens, judging from his posts. Wouldn't be bad to have a stainless blade, too!

 

Please tell us what happens in this quest. Good Luck.

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Well, it looks like i'm going to add two kaiGunto's to the collection :)

 

First of all the second sword I posted, with the 2 ashi and the steel seppa's. I get that one this month. Even tough it might be overpriced, I find it quite interesting as a piece of militaria with the rustless blade.

 

And the kaiGunto Neil offered me from his collection(below). Thanks again! I get that sword next month, need to make some room and get some funds from my german collection :)

 

post-5015-0-09247500-1570734488_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-74959000-1570734494_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-99382600-1570734504_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-39508200-1570734515_thumb.jpgpost-5015-0-51855400-1570734520_thumb.jpg

 

Thanks again Neil, and ofcourse everyone else as well! Wouldn't have found the interesting information and ofcourse this offered sword, without you guys! :)

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#sword 2 - Double ashi

The second sword appears to have a Toyokawa Naval Arsenal 豊川海軍工廠 logo.  Toyokawa Naval Arsenal was officially opened in December 1939.  Not sure if this stamp appears in the Arsenal Stamps thread or not.

 

Looking at the stamp with a magnifying glass, it looks like a Tenshozan stamp.  Compare it to this stamp.

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