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Sword Art and Appreciation


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a side note or two, art is what we make it, having been in ART school and all the night long decisions on what is art have come rolling back, if you draw the diagrams but have a union welder weld it is it still art...the list is endless. one request to this thought provoking thread...please spilt it from the Ebay sword Kotetsu ...its no longer about a Ebay sale.

I'm enjoying the trip down memory lane with all the who what is art... and if you have ever held a sword that takes your breath away you'd say it was a beautiful thing, but it was made by man which makes it art.

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Hi Brian,

 

I think in fact this is more than semantic hair splitting, we're established already that we aren't all interested in the same thing. :? We all come to this with our own sets of criteria and prejudices.

 

As to swords not having been made as art in the past, I'm not too sure about that. I believe it is quite well documented that the finest swords have been appreciated as art from at least as early as the beginning of the Kamakura period. How did these earliest connoisseurs evaluate the swords that have come down to us as masterpieces? How did they appreciate the finer aesthetic of the blade with no NBTHK to tell them? ...and they were all shinsakuto blades back then :shock: when they were new. We know that polishing techniques have developed tremendously in the modern period but it seems clear that most of the details of the steel were noted in the past. There is a lot more we could discuss on this issue too.

 

What we do all agree on is that these are weapons, first and foremost. But, clearly some are a lot more than that. Like paintings, we can all agree on what they are and in have a general consensus about what is passable and what is awful but things get trickier as we attempt to define those we judge to be exceptional.

 

I don't agree that we all know what makes them special, this thread has proved that point :D What I'm arguing for is exactly a more in depth way of discussing this vague idea of "sword as art". It is precisely because it hasn't been thrashed out in discussions and debate that it is so vague as to mean whatever anyone wants it to. We'll never reach an absolute answer but the discussion will keep us on our toes at least.

 

As Reinhard predicts; the next generation will no doubt do it all again, but that is what keeps the study vital and keeps us thinking and looking ever more carefully.

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Maybe this is more hair-splitting, but...

 

Much is spoken of "grades" of swords, indeed the NBTHK and the like have systems of grading that group blades into different levels. However, even the published criteria don't specify aesthetic requirements other than in vague terms. Say we have two swords, virtually identical in sugata, hada, hamon, hataraki, but one has more kinsuji than the other. Or one is nie deki and the other is nioi deki. Which is better? Which is more desirable, from an aesthetic standpoint? Which would get a higher ranking from the NBTHK? The real problem is that when is comes down to details, things are very subjective. I've often seen statements that are condescending to those who prefer big flashy hamon, yet this would seem to contradict the indications that a lot of activity is desirable (no, I'm not confusing activity with complex patterns, just that there is often much going on in large midare, gunome and choji hamon). This stems from the aesthetic, and I would respectfully submit that this is why I disagree with Guido's quoted article. Yes, there are well-defined criteria, but they are only half the story.

 

On the other hand, much of what is deemed desirable in nihonto stems from functional parameters (i.e. whether or not it was a good, functional blade that would stand up in battle). There is an example in Nagayama's where he is talking about ara-nie and ko-nie, and mentions that other types of nie are not particularly desirable. Why is this - is it because of artistic sensibility or is it considered a flaw in workmanship? The different (individual and cultural) aesthetic sensibilities involved don't make it any easier. Is one better than the other? If so, why?

 

I'd love to see a discussion like Ford mentioned that follows stylistic developments from an aesthetic point of view. Several different authorities over the years have also tried to come up with various ranking systems as well, yet all are deemed to fall short in some way, why is this? Perhaps a discussion along the lines of Ford's suggestion could bring us closer to a viable system?

 

cheers,

/steve

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Guest reinhard
Say we have two swords, virtually identical in sugata, hada, hamon, hataraki, but one has more kinsuji than the other. Or one is nie deki and the other is nioi deki. Which is better? Which is more desirable, from an aesthetic standpoint? Which would get a higher ranking from the NBTHK? The real problem is that when is comes down to details, things are very subjective.

 

No, they are not. First of all, you will hardly find two swords virtually identical, not even by the same smith, but what's more important: You're arguments are reduced to book-learning. Most of the non-Japanese books are about basics. Difference of nie/nioi, what are hataraki and so on. What most of these books won't tell you: You can start from there but still don't know anything yet. Nie, for example can be found in many different variations in the Ji or in the Ha. They can be small or big, well-defined or shapeless, brilliant and highly reflective or dull and coincidential, evenly spread over the entire blade or coming in clusters here and there. - And even these features cannot be reduced to make a general rule. - MASAMUNE, the ultimate master of Nie, created patterns of Nie in such an unorthodox way, it would have been regarded a mistake by any other smith, but handling his swords first hand, you will immediately realize: It was all done on purpose. - It was a great honor and pleasure for me to handle the "Komatsu MASAMUNE" two years ago. It looks quite unpretentious on photographs and oshigata, and it didn't do much to change my prejudices at first. But when loooking at the Ji for a minute or two, structures started to rise from the depths of the steel. It was as if I was looking into a deep pond in the night and shapes cristallized from the deep slowly. Same thing with the Hamon. A tiny change of angle let one Hamon disappear and another one could be seen. I felt dizzy, confused and euphoric when giving the blade back. - This is what (timeless) art is all about. Leaving you breathless and opening doors you can't open by yourself (agree with Stephen).

 

For a second I envied the great Daimyo Maeda Toshitsune for having the senses to keep this little tanto when retiring from worldly business and moving to a place called Ko-Matsu.

 

reinhard

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Very interesting discussion gentlemen and it is odd that my introduction to Nihonto followed many years collecting bayonets and military swords, mostly british and commonwealth blades. After 250 bayonets and 150 swords, I will admit the aquisition was the deal as with any collection but the history of the swords themselves and the military useage was a great introduction to edged weapons and it was only natural to finally get into the ultimate edged weapon of all time the Japanese sword. SO rather than an immediate respect for the art I was properly impressed and studied the usage of all Japanese edged weapons for the reason they were made - as weapons through history and how they evolved to suit the warriors that had to use them in battle. How they were created to hold an edge like a razor and yet be strong and flexible to last. I guess it is like any other utilitarian object that once efficient in design and manufacture for its intended use - one can actually appreciate the art that goes into them. The designs on the hamon and the activity that you see were added by the smiths and I see them like the engraving on a silver plated colt revolver. Plain or majestic, both pistols will shoot and kill.

 

So I am sure that the beauty of the blades was long admired and as with presentation pistols one would not necessarily take them out to war in the mud. Equally effective but not as utilitarian.

 

Now I can look at nihonto for the artistic, individualistic characteristics added by smiths to make them unique, always well aware of why they were made in the first place. Art does follow function.

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This is really heartening to read, Gentlemen. It would appear we are all hungry for more regarding those aspects of the art of the sword that aren't covered in the basic texts available in English.

 

Reinhard, The very eloquent description of the Masamune blade you gave is an excellent starting point, this sort of detail, about the particular "expression in steel" of a particular smith is where I think we can really start to see the sword as true art. As you said, Masamune's handling of nie would be seen as a fault in a lesser smith but in the hands of this master it becomes one of his defining traits of brilliance. I'd like to think that those of us who are now made more aware of this feature will be a little more attuned to the next Masamune blade we will encounter ( however rarely that may be )...that door has just been nudged open a little wider.

 

I would like to propose that we could also be considering the overall aesthetic impact of a given sword in sculptural terms. We are all informed, to varying degrees, as to what a functional sword looks like, form follows function, but therein lies a world of subtle variation. Each minute change alters the overall effect. The width, thickness length ect, the size and shape of the kissaki, the contrast with the nakago. What does the look of the hada add in terms of the feel of the sword. The hamon is practically a subject on it's own, the polished steel being the canvas for a sumi-e in nie and nioi. What does the artistic sensibility expressed in a hamon of a particular smith tells us, and how does this relate to the rest of the blade in purely aesthetic terms? My instinct tells me that the truly great swords somehow manage to bring all these aspects in to an un-contrived harmony. I'm excited at the possibility of catching a glimpse of this...

 

I suppose what I'm getting at is the need to understand art swords as compositions in steel. We label all the various details but do we really consider their contribution to the overall artistic expression. We can similarly analysise a painting, noting the perspective, composition, the colour pallete, the tonal values, texture etc etc...but we don't stop there. We relate all of this information the the contribution it makes to the overall artistic vision of the painter. Did he get it right...?

 

We've analysed the sword, now I think we could gain something by contemplating how it all combines to create art. It is a very abstract art we're looking at, perhaps uniquely so, and undoubtedly Japanese, just like tea bowls in so many ways.

 

Perhaps the appreciation of tea bowls is not so far from the love of art swords either.

 

We could also probably start a parallel discussion regarding tosugo.

 

regards, Ford

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Hi Ford,

 

We've analysed the sword, now I think we could gain something by contemplating how it all combines to create art

 

Please don't shoot the pianist. Is not creativity the essence of Art??

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Ford,

I commend your ideas I think it would be extremely worthwhile (though incredibly difficult). You mentioned with painting composition, colour brushwork etc. I think, as with painting it is not enough that these individual aspects are well done they have to compliment each other and contribute to the whole. What makes a sword stand out (for me) is when all of the main elements shape, hada,hamon, nakago combine to create a product that is greater than the individual components. This is where it becomes extremely subjective but it is well worth trying to define.

In my own limited exposure to top rated swords ther have been those that have left me cold but others that I have actually felt that I was in the presence of greatness (sorry if that sounds over dramatic but for a confirmed agnostic its as near to spiritual as i can get) It was the way that the different elements combined together in to a complete item, no particular feature stood out to the detriment of others and all worked in harmony together.

For me this is best achieved in the works of Awataguchi smiths (the few i have seen) and to a lesser extent in other Yamashiro blades. The quiet understated elegance of these swords is stunning.

I think this could be a valuable conversation although unlikely or unable to produce concrete answers.

I look forward to hearing more

Regards

Paul b

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Hi Paul,

 

thanks for the vote of confidence :) . The whole proposition is indeed, massively complicated...but it has to start somewhere. Just as with the ongoing discussion around art in general.

 

You are absolutely right too, to state that we won't reach any answers but I don't think that's the point. In any philosophical exploration of meaning, and art is one of the big ones, there is no ultimate, sacred truth to be found. Those " ideals" that are sometimes held to be truths are actually only of value to us in terms of their usefulness.

 

Guido's essay describes the process of learning we need to embark on, others have also described how our appreciation "matures" with continued exposure to this art form. Some sort of road map from those who claim to see more might be of great value in helping to form a more sensitive and refined understanding of the subject.

 

You raised the issue of subjectivity in taste and I'd agree, this will always be present but it came from somewhere, we weren't born with innate tastes in Japanese swords,...so it can continue to be "informed". Perhaps it's time for a more poetic reading of the subject...to counter balance the very academic approach this seems to dominate. We may discover in fact that this is where we will begin to see the real art.

 

I realise that by leaning so far off in this "arty" direction I run the risk of sounding a bit "hippie", for want of a better word, but there is precedent in appreciating art in more poetic terms. It may in fact be the only way to convey this aspect in words.

 

regards, Ford

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Guest reinhard
Perhaps the appreciation of tea bowls is not so far from the love of art swords either.

 

Ford,

 

There is a major difference. I'd like to quote Ogasawara-san (retired head conservator, Tokyo National Museum), one of the world's foremost authorities in the field of NihonTo:

 

"...Masterpieces were born, when first-class swordsmiths worked skillfully using good quality steel.

With ceramics or porcelains, for example, it can happen by chance that an unexpectedly nice piece is born, depending on conditions inside the furnace. This kind of accidental effect can never be expected in sword production..."

 

What separates high-class NihonTo from many other forms of art is full control by the smith during every step of the making. Retempering, f.e., sometimes creates isolated clusters of huge, ugly mura-nie. They might look spectacular to people unfamiliar with NihonTo, but it would be a silly attitude to claim this feature to be a quality yet undiscovered. Criteria of quality have been handed down for hundreds of years, always connected to function and beauty. Now some of the more subtle Japanese aesthetics are not easy to comprehend. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. There is an expression often used to describe the nioi-guchi of masterpieces: "saeru". This is very hard to translate. The Nelson says: "be clear, be serene, be cold, be skillful"; but this is nothing but a vague hint. Handling swords with this feature will make it clear all of a sudden. It is a kind of beauty which cannot be adequately described nor photographed. It will also make you understand, that this kind of quality, over the entire length of the blade, demands superb control and can never be the result of a lucky coincidence (as it can be in the case of a tea bowl).

 

reinhard

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Hello Reihard,

 

I agree absolutely with you when you make the distinction that with clay there is always an element of serendipity whereas with the master swordsmith the elements are more controlled, I don't know if I agree that it is absolutely under control though. But that may be a moot point.

 

What I was trying to get across was an attitude regarding the aesthetic appreciation, not similarities in the objects or their manner of creation. I recognize that the awareness of the processes involved etc may add a great deal to the experience ( as Guido describes in his essay ) and in that the two, sword and tea bowl, are different but never the less I think there may be something to be gained from looking at these, apparently, unrelated cultural icons. After all, both are born of earth, fire and water ;) and express very Japanese aesthetic concerns.

 

Regards, Ford

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IMO there's not that much of a difference between swords and pottery (and possibly Sumi-e and a few other traditional crafts/arts). I see swords and pottery as close enough to compare them; they have at least one thing in common: fire is an element that can't be controlled 100%, and the outcome of exposing an object to it can be predicted only to a certain degree.

 

The function of a Chawan is to hold tea, and the function of a sword is to cut. The better the craftsman, the better he will install this function. People who want to quench their thirst, or people who practice Tameshigiri and/or IaidÅ, are satisfied if the functionality is average or better than that. Controlling fire and clay / fire and glaze better than his peers, and therefore making the object to function better and looking more pleasing, is the achievement of a great craftsman.

 

If a tea bowl or sword doesn't only properly work as such, but is also aesthetically appealing, we're entering the world of art. Controlling all of the above, making the object functional and beautiful, and still giving the bowl or blade the appearance of being natural, or even random as a result of the powerful, unpredictable element of fire, is the hallmark of a truly great artist. I call it the "Japanese garden effect": controlling nature in a way that makes the result looking more natural than nature itself. A contradiction, perhaps, but it works for me.

 

This genius is seen, for instance, in the works of Masamune, and I think that's what Reinhard was talking about. It leaves me in a state of (pleasant) emotional shock, and swords like that indeed have kind of a presence. OTOH, my feelings could be the result of residue of the stuff I smoked back in the seventies/the army, who knows.

 

Although beauty certainly is in the eye of the beholder, educated people usually find a consensus about aesthetics pretty easily. Some art forms, and especially traditional Japanese art, however, can't be properly judged and appreciated without knowledge of its cultural context and its technical aspects. That's where studying the subject in-depth comes in, and that's where many people give up, finding it too tiresome. Still being intrigued by the romantic aspect of the "Samurai Sword", they hang on nonetheless, concentrating on topics where, they think, matters of opinion are discussed.

 

Once we have a solid basis of being familiar with all the technical aspects, roads, schools, styles etc. we either can stop there - becoming a collector of superior craft objects (and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that!) - or we can "advance" to the twilight zone of art appreciation. *Now* we can discuss matters of taste (for example, I personally prefer Sadamune to Masamune), but at least we're on the same page. Unlike going uuuh and aaah over the Hamon of a generic Sukesada of the Sengoku period because it looks like crabs claws. (Heck, I *love* crabs, preferably with a little lemon, but I don't care for their image on my sword. In case this caused some offense, I apologize to all crab lovers, both sword and animal related ones.)

 

Do I really know what art is? Maybe, maybe not. Actually I'm rather convinced that I do. But then again, I'm neither really sure of the side-effects of the weed back then, nor all the booze after it. Please feel free to make this your Zen quote of the day.

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Guest reinhard

I would like to show you an example of true art vs. supreme craftsmanship. The blade on top depicts a blade by MITSUTADA, founder of the Osafune-school, dating from mid-Kamakura period. Being great art it is complex, refined and most of all: it is original and radiates a relaxed feeling.

The one below depicts a blade by TOSHITSUNE of the Edo-Ishido school, dating from Kambun era. It is, beyond doubt, a blade of high quality, made in the footprints of older masters. Compared to the MITSUTADA blade, it is a stiff and awkward attempt of recreating something, that existed before. That's why MITSUTADA was a true artist and TOSHITSUNE was "only" a great craftsman. TOSHITSUNE remained in the attempt of copying, without creating something new.

Both blades are highly effective weapons, of course, but this is not what it's all about.

 

reinhard

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