Another Zunari.....

[Gilles]

Dear all,

 

Like Javier in his last topic, I could not resist to acquire a zunari. I think that this one can be qualified as HINENO-ZUNARI.

 

It is signed Hirata Kaneyuki. Please note the modification of the visor (mabizashi) which is quite prominent.

 

Also like Javier, I would like to hear any further explanation from experienced members of the forum about the shape of this helmet and about this armor maker. Kaneyuki seems to be only referenced in the Chappelear book (pages 220, 221).

 

I would also need some explanations about the shape of the shikoro which is of the Hineno type. Can someone explain to me what are the features of the Hineno type shikoro ?

 

I believe that this shikoro is original to this kabuto, is that right ?

 

As you see, I have a lot of questions and I need you to help me.

 

I am aware that it is not a high quality kabuto but I like its spartan shape.

 

 

 

[Shogun8]

Hi Gilles,

 

I owned the brother of this kabuto, except mine was signed by Asai Tomoyuki. I did quite a bit of research on my kabuto and found the references that you've found in the Chappelear. I also know that there is another example in a European collection but I'm not sure if it's signed and by whom. The kabuto is actually extremely robust and well-made and has several small details which indicate quality to me, such as the cut corners of the front plate and the tsuke mabezashi/front plate in one piece. To answer your question about the shikoro, what makes it a hineno-jikoro is the fact that it is close-fitting (i.e. drops down from the more vertical koshimaki) and it curves to fit around the shoulder. Other shikoro like o-manju are straight edge and flare out from the kabuto itself due to the koshimaki being more horizontal (with varying degrees based on type).

 

 

 

[uwe]

John beaten me .....

The similarities to "Asai Tomoyuki" are obvious.

[Shogun8]

John beaten me .....

The similarities to "Asai Tomoyuki" are obvious.

 

Or, is it the other way around, Uwe? I have found no reference to Asai Tomoyuki, only for Hirata Kaneyuki.

 

Another interesting note - if I remember correctly, it is said in the Chappelear that there are only one or two makers who made zunari with tsuke mabezashi.

[DaveT]

A lot of similarities are shared between these two Kabuto.

What I like is the slight variation in the dan of the shikoro. From the hachi-tsuke-ita to the Yon-no-ita having almost identical sabi-nuri relief. 
But the difference (personal taste of the original owner) with the Kata-zuri-no-ita, Gilles having uname-ito just gives it that extra touch of quality.
Both are splendid examples of zunari with the Tsuke-mabezashi / sanko-no-byo adaption. 

[uwe]

John,

 

as far as I know Asai is a family name. I found Katsumitsu (Asai Jubei, who moved to Kanazawa), Asai Katsushige and this Asai Tomoyuki. Although I don`t know if the sources can be trusted! So we have to find the connection between Hirata and the Asai.

But that is another topic!

[Gilles]

Thank you very much gentlemen for those explanation and clarification. They are very welcome.

 

Can you tell me in what period HIRATA KANEYOSHI and ASAI TOMOYUKI were living ? Were they contemporaries ?

 

I surmise that HIRATA KANEYOSHI was living in the end of the 18th century ??? is that right ???

[Luc T]

This kind of kabuto is rather late edo indeed

[Shogun8]

Now that I look at Gilles' pictures more closely, there are some quite noticeable differences:

 

Gilles' kabuto has a more typical mabezashi that is separate from the front plate, while the Asai kabuto has the mabezashi and front plate in one piece.

 

The Asai kabuto also has a very straight top edge for the front plate, while the one on Gilles' seems to dip down.

[Gilles]

Dear Luc and John,

 

Thank you Luc for this information. Can you tell me if this kabuto was made during the BAKUMATSU era or prior to that time ?

 

John, how can you explain the difference you mention in your last post ?

[Shogun8]

Gilles,

 

I forgot to post a picture of the area I mention above (tsuke mabezashi made in one piece with the front plate and straight top edge of front plate), which I now do here:

 

 

Also, going back to your original question about the shikoro on your kabuto, it only seems to have a very slight curvature on the lowermost lame and in some of the pictures it looks almost straight. If it is straight then it would not be classified as a hineno jikoro. The shikoro on the Asai kabuto is of the hineno variety as can be clearly seen in the second picture.

[IanB]

Uwe,  Yes you can trust the details about the Asai family, who were Haruta smiths. The history was discovered by Dr.Orikasa in the Maeda papers in Kanezawa library.

The Asai Dentaro family started with Jubei who signed Katsumitsu who moved from Kyoto to Kanezawa in 1623

Followed by another Katsumitsu who had a pupil Sonoki Tazaemon (Since the dates when these two died are unknown, I suspect they may be one and the same)

Mitsunao (Unkai) died 1708 students- Mitsuyasu, Matsunaga Shiroe.

Toshinao died 1727 students - Naohira and Haruta Chujiro

Naotomo called Gorokuro, died 1735

Mitsutomo died 1781

Mitsunaga died 1805 stated to be ordinary craftsman as opposed to Dosuke (I think this means head of the workshop)

Mitsusada died 1807 ordinary craftsman 

Mitsutaka died 1870 ordinary craftsmen

Ian Bottomley

[Shogun8]

Ian,

 

For the denser ones amongst us, can you further explain the connection between the Asai and the Unkai that I think you're making based on the above? Is it because of the "mitsu" (i.e. Katsumitsu > Mitsunao)? If so, would a connection like this be made through marriage, or a lord or head of a workshop "bestowing" the name, or something else?

 

John

[IanB]

John,  I am not making any connection - simply quoting from Dr. Orikasa's work. However, much of all this confusion arises from the system of names used in Japan which is more than a bit confusing.. For a fuller account I refer you to Koop and Inada, 'Japanese Names and How to Read Them' , Routledge & Kegan Paul, London 1923,. ISBN 0 7100 1707 3. page 67 et seq.

Prior to 1870, only court nobles, members of the buke and those craftsmen privileged to do so were allowed to use a family name. Every one else had to use a name describing their occupation. Individuals had a succession of names starting with a boy's name or yomio that changed at 15  to a zokumio by which they were ordinarily known. The higher ranks and specially privileged lower classes could also use a nanori - a name restricted for use on special occasions such as in a signature. Craftspeople and artists could, totally independent of the family name and never used with it, could also use an 'Art name' or go.  

 

So what we are dealing with here is a family, associated with the armour making group called Haruta, had a founder who had the privilege of using a surname, Asai,浅井 and who had the personal name Jubei 重兵衛. It was he who moved to Kanazawa in 1623.. He signed his work with the nanori  Katsumitsu 勝光.  He was followed by, either his son or grandson, who was Asai Dosuke 浅井動助 who used the nanori Mitsunao 光尚. However Mitsunao also chose to use an 'Art name' Unkai 雲海. So when his wife was shouting for him to stop drinking sake she would use Dosuke, but when he signed a helmet he would use either just Mitsunao or he could add his art name as well and sign Unkai Mitsunao. He would never use Asai Mitsunao or Unkai Dosuke which mixes up two different name systems.

 

While it was common for a pupil to be granted the use of a character from the nanori of his master, the fact that several smiths, with say the character Mitsu, does not necessarily mean they were linked in any way Haruta.

Ian Bottomley

[Shogun8]

Very helpful, Ian - thank you!

[uwe]

Something to keep in mind Ian. Many thanks!!

Now to the Hirata “thing” ????

[IanB]

Right. Sasama mentions a zunari signed Hirata Kaneyuki and then says nothing is known of him. I would guess he may have been an independent armourer of which they were many. It is possible he studied under Asai Tomoyuki  but let us recognise that armourers were not like swordsmiths and most people would cross the street rather than go near them.

Ian B

[DaveT]

Right. Sasama mentions a zunari signed Hirata Kaneyuki and then says nothing is known of him. I would guess he may have been an independent armourer of which they were many. It is possible he studied under Asai Tomoyuki  but let us recognise that armourers were not like swordsmiths and most people would cross the street rather than go near them.

Ian B

I know that feeling

[uwe]

Ian,

 

I wonder if Hirata was a family name, or a name of a place of some sort?!

[IanB]

Uwe,  Hirata is a common surname written as 平田. I don't think it gets us any further.

Ian B

[uwe]

A pity.

I harbored a little hope it could be a village or similar....

[Gilles]

So do I.

I am quite surprised that such an armourer from the end of the 19th century has left no other trace than several kanji in five or six kabuto.....

As I am still a sword collector, swordsmiths are easier to follow than armourers.

There must be a very big difference of status between those two corporations as Ian told us previously.

 

Anyway, thank you everybody for having shared your knowledge.

[Luc T]

Swords are offensive

Armor is protection....

The Japanese approach, yes...

[Luc T]

Right. Sasama mentions a zunari signed Hirata Kaneyuki and then says nothing is known of him. I would guess he may have been an independent armourer of which they were many. It is possible he studied under Asai Tomoyuki  but let us recognise that armourers were not like swordsmiths and most people would cross the street rather than go near them.

Ian B

Dear Ian,

As there are so many copies of Gitsu, Takayoshi, and the ghost (you know who I am referring to), they must have had a certain reputation and status. Orikasa allways told me, the owner of such a masterpiece gained respect in his environment, en was envied for the subtle beauty of their work. So, some of them must have been adorated during their life?

[IanB]

Luc,  Yes there were some armourers who were highly respected and whose products were much desired, but as a group they were shunned - as people who work in shoe shops today are treated a bit differently. Contrast the vast amount that is recorded about swordsmiths, and who signed their work, with someone like Yoshimichi. What do we really know about him? To be given a Yoshimichi helmet would be an honour - to visit his workshop would be defiling because of the leather and skins there.

Ian B

[Shogun8]

John,

 

as far as I know Asai is a family name. I found Katsumitsu (Asai Jubei, who moved to Kanazawa), Asai Katsushige and this Asai Tomoyuki. Although I don`t know if the sources can be trusted! So we have to find the connection between Hirata and the Asai.

But that is another topic!

Uwe,

 

I'm reading Takemura-san's article on Yukinoshita dou, and I see that Date Masamune twice gave a gift of armour to an Asai Bitchû no Kami who is listed as a messenger of the Kasai family...