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Mori Kunitoshi


21g

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Hello everyone.

A family friend has asked me to help him with an heirloom, as he hates the interwebs.

 

This forum seems like the best place to communicate with knowledgeable, "sane" people. I have found enough info to know what the blade is but need some help moving forward. Any help would be appreciated.

 

I posted in an older thread (niji kunitoshi) also.

 

Thank you for allowing me to join.

Wade

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  • 2 weeks later...

this blade is driving me nuts... i know its in rough shape and needs polished and mounted, but i cant tell if there is star or not. 

can you guys tell me what you think? gendaito or showato? any gunto collectors that may have more info, please contact me. i would like this to go to a collector that will appreciate and restore... thanks

 

wade 

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Historically, is there any reason someone would remove the star stamp? While taking better pics I realized someone filed and tried to make it look like they hadn't...

You can see a what appears to be a star when viewed at the right angle and light. The mysterious chisel marks on the mune are located very close. Could they be related somehow?

 

 

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If a star stamp was removed, which I'm not saying yes or no, it could have been because not too long ago, star stamped blades were immediately dismissed as showato, much like Seki and Sho(wa) stamped blades. In the last 10 years, that thought has changed due to a lot of effort on the part of a handful of collectors and researchers here in the states.

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what does "seki ma" mean?

 

The definition of ma is interesting. When put together, is the definition different?

 

In the thread "Niji Kunitoshi" a member (Ben) mentioned having owned a hand made blade by this smith. IMHO it definitely had a star (maybe three stars, is this possible?) and I am not convinced it's Showa-to. Though I understand all signs point to machine made, why would it be "hand signed" (chiseled)? 

 

Can anyone share more info about this smith with me? I am now completely intrigued by nihonto and hope..scratch that... and WHEN I win the lotto would like to collect seriously. For now, just need info on one swordsmith.

 

Thank you all for the help. This feels like a college level course and I really appreciate it!

 

wade

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It says in Sloughs book medium to high grade gendai. Doesn't say anything about showato. Sloughs book usually says if they made showato as well. Noting that Sloughs book is not "THE" diffinitive on these war time blades.

 

I owned one by this smith for a while and I believe it to be genuine hand made non showato gendai blade. It did not have a star stamp or any other stamp on it and was not dated. The signature was identical to this one. 

 

Maybe if the OP can have a window opened up and then you would know ?

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I tried to get the story from the owner and it only makes me more sceptical about showa...

 

The youngest of nine siblings, his uncle "Johnny" brought this blade home from the war. He claimed he had shot three officers, taken the blade from and "finished off" one officer who was cursing him as he bled out. Johnny was a "quiet" man and not known to ever tell a lie, according to the owner.

Years ago, this blade had white/pearl colored mounting and was properly kept. A friend(s) of an older brother stole the sword and through luck was recovered. Now missing all accessories and cleaned up, my friend stored it away.

A few years ago, he took the blade to a local gun store, which translated the mei and date but gave no details about the Smith.

Recently, my friend, now in his 50s, has had some health issues followed by financial issues of course. Not knowing the difficulty, I agreed to help establish a value and sell before he's gone. He needs to know his "heirloom" is preserved and that he hasn't disgraced his family by getting "robbed" again. (But mentioned trading for an ar-15 if that was ever an option)

Thanks to this forum and help from you amazing people, I was able to tell him more about it than anyone previously and he was very surprised.

I appologize for just jumping into your conversations without following the rules. I became impatient and was ecstatic to find the swordsmith in an older thread, not fully understanding what this site was. Sorry!

I now understand.

Without disposable income to invest, I find myself right back where I started... unsure of value and looking for trusted, qualified persons that can point me in the right direction.

It appears that Fred may be my best option, if I get permission to send. My brother moved to Des Moines last summer and I would like to visit him for the holidays. I could meet with Stephen(if willing) to verify, ECT. If that would help.

 

Questions: how much should I expect to pay to have a window opened? Who would you recommend?

 

Wade

 

P.S. if the story was inappropriate, I appologize. Don't wish to offend anyone.

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  • 1 month later...

Dear Wade.

 

The story attached to this blade is, of course, fascinating however it has no bearing on the value.  So far what we have is a blade which is not in good condition and should anyone chose to restore just a polish is going to cost hundreds of dollars.  Whatever it had as mounts it is now just a blade.

 

The key points are that while we all wish it had a star stamp it doesn't.  It does have a Seki stamp and for almost everyone this means it is not a gendaito.

 

Hamfish points out that the tip is very badly damaged which will almost certainly have removed the tempered edge which renders the blade valueless as a collectible.

 

I can tell that the story and the fact that it is a real blade have ignited some real interest in you and perhaps that will be the real value here.

 

All the best and keep saving for your next sword.

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Im not 100% sure on that Josh, ive had my fair share of Gendaito with patina less nakago, Nagamitsu Emura ect.

Yes Stephen thats true. It's the kind of forging the steel. They didn't rust very fast. Btw i read last an article in which they said that the iron sand in Japan is sometimes very different. The Tamahagene is from different quality in the provinces. So sometimes you see old blades with less oder thiner patina. I didn't know if its true or not. 

 

The Kunitoshi have a Star Stamp and a Seki Stamp for its gendaito.

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