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Counterfeit Sukehiro Wak


roys101

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Hi. Went to Eugene, Oregon knife show last weekend. I'm fortunate to live only 60 miles away. Brought a wak with me, which has kanji (?) on the left-hand side of tang. Two persons read the markings as Sukehiro, and said the blade was from the 1700-1800s. One of them, a nihonjin, said it was gemei (fake). The third person said the blade was from the 1930s, based on the fuller or blood groove. The condition of the wak is poor, with rust. Plus, it's missing the habaki. I'm tempted to sand-blast the blade, and parkerize it, but I know that's sacrilege. I live in sort of a bad neighbourhood, and a local guy brought the blade to my door, looking for $25 gas money, which I gave him. I figure the blade is worth about $150 (?). Can someone translate the markings for me? Thanks. post-3237-0-01320800-1429122796_thumb.jpg

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If you want more information on whether it is authentic, you should make some clean photo's of the entire piece, because even though the signature might not fit the work itself (if any of it is visible), there will be people that can point you in the right direction based on shape and form.

 

I"m a novice but to me the signature doesn't look to well-done..

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Echizen no Kami means Lord of Echizen Province, an honorary title.  Minamoto is a clan name and Sukehiro is the smith's name.  A famous name so forgery (fake signature) is a strong possibility.

Do not take steel wool to the blade!!!  Anything like that you try is very likely to do serious damage and, in the long run, cost you serious money.  Put on a very light coat of sewing machine oil and get it to someone who knows Nihonto and who can give you a better idea what you have.

Grey

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Grey, Thanks again. Someone said I could scrub the blade with pumice. Do I dare do that? I will put sewing machine oil on. I bought a habaki at the Eugene show for $15. I will make a tsuba out of copper bus bar I have, about 3/16s thick. I will make a handle out of micarta, and a scabbard from hard wood. I will not have to adulterate the blade in any way. What about the fuller? Does the presence of a fuller mean the blade is modern?

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Hi Chris,

You can get yourself an uchiko ball and use it with facial tissue to remove loose, surface rust.  A lot of the crud will come off but much will be left behind.  And then oil it to keep the rust from progressing.

And stop listening to knuckle heads who tell you to use steel wool, motor oil, pumice, whatever.  Oil & uchiko and nothing else without experience to know what you're doing.

If you make a scabbard from hardwood make sure it isn't a wood with an acid content (like oak).

Grey

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It is not modern. Whoever said it was 1930's was smoking something. Even a fake signature doesn't make it junk. So leave anything abrasive, and skip the home-polishing jobs that will cost you $2000 to undo oneday. It's probably 1600's at a wild guess. If you see the guy again, give him another 50 bucks.

 

Brian

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Please dont touch this blade.   just oil it, do not attempt to remove the rust.  even if you start "making" parts for it you could damage it.  It is worthy of restoration from a cursory picture look.

 

Cheers.

 

Louie

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Chris,  You seem to have your heart set on destroying a Japanese sword.  You've been given good advice from people with decades of experience: uchiko, oil, nothing else.

And if you still insist on trying to fix the sword with zero knowledge how to do it, just take a pile of money, set it on the floor, and set it on fire.  You'll accomplish the same end and the sword will be spared your efforts.

Grey

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"Should I kill this sword?"

 

no you shouldn't.

 

"Should I kill this sword in another way?"

 

no you shouldn't.

 

"Should I kill this sword in a third way?"

 

no you shouldn't.

 

Please listen to what people are telling you. Louis has good advice. Just oil it, uchiko at most as Grey said. Don't try to fix-r-uppr on your workbench, you will cost yourself if the sword has any potential.

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:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

 

Axel, just take 1000 percent profit from someone here and call it a great buy. :)

It may be fire burned, it may not be. The hi are promising. I bet a lot of us would like to know if it is salvageable and what it would look like restored. At the least, get a professional window polished to see what is under there.

 

Brian

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WTF !!!!   Do you not understand English ?  Did you not ask for advice ?  

With one post you are running a close second to a recently exited member for the hardest head ever !!

 

FORGET EVERYTHING YOU WERE TOLD AT THE KNIFE SHOW, EVERYTHING !!!!!!

 

Everything you have have asked about doing, can potentially ruin the sword, making it worthless (no $$$) !!!!

 

You have found the place to get correct and accurate advice on how to care for this antique. You have been given accurate advice.   Now LISTEN to it !!!

 

DO NOT SAND, PUMICE, JELLY, BLAST, GRIND, RUB, HAMMER, BEAT, BANG OR ALTER THE CONDITION OF THIS SWORD IN ANY WAY, PERIOD !!!!!

 

You should do nothing more than oil the sword with a light machine oil like 3-in-1 oil.  Keep it in an oiled rag until you can have it looked at by someone who is qualified to give you advice.  NO, not the next knife and gun show.

 

Your best bet might be to sell it to someone here who would care for it or restore it properly.

 

In fact, to prevent you ruining it, I'll make you an offer for it before you do anything to it:   $250

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I will oil it and that is all

Good, glad I got the point across. 

 

I derive no satisfaction speaking to anyone in an ill manner.  

Yet, make no mistake, my only concern is that you will ruin that sword, not your feelings.

 

You are welcome here, if you wish to listen and learn.  

 

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