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Remember this when you see a papered Tanto/Wak next....


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WoW, cheaper and faster than shinsa !! No Juyo, I want Juyo papers for all my swords. :crazy:

 

Seriously, as Jean stated this has been discussed before, but newer members and especially newbs to sword collecting should see this.

 

I posted a couple of years ago, when discussing the pitfalls of e-bay, how I had seen a sword on e-bay being sold "with papers". To the inexperienced this may look inviting, however the papers were not issued for the sword being sold. I wrote the e-bay dealer and inquired about these papers. He replied, "yes, it comes with papers but they have nothing to do with this sword" !! He was very matter of fact as though nothing was wrong, and in his eyes it was "your" fault for not being better prepared. His opinion was Caveat emptor: "Let the buyer beware"

 

BTW: He is still selling on E-bay.

 

My advise: Keep buying on E-bay, where deals abound and treasures await !

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Denis, if you look at the description in the text of the auction he is talking about a Tanto.

 

Jean, True. It has been discussed before. No reason not to keep warning others.

 

I agree that Ebay is a hornet's nest when you do not know your stuff. I also have been scammed on there

with a Kabuto which never arrived only to later (after filing charges internationally) discover that it was a

Romanian gang. never saw the money back.

 

Sometimes, just sometimes, you get lucky. Like with the Edo Period booklet about swords I scanned for all of you and

posted on the forum. Another copy is for sale at the moment for 450 US$. I got mine for a fraction of that price.

 

Last week I bid on a "destroyed" tsuba. Why? because it could be repatinated. Did not win it, but thats ok.

 

I still think it is important to warn about these things and fraudulent sellers and sketchy auctions in this section since

there is no specific "Warning" section.

 

KM

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Well, I'd say that even the most recent beginner should be able to figure out that the sword has a mei and the paper is for a mumei blade, or any other obvious mismatch. :lol:

 

However, if the seller manages to pair a sword with a paper issued for a very similar but still different sword, the situation changes dramatically. Particularly if no mei is involved, the nagako looks similar, the sword belongs to the same school (or even worse, the same smith) and so on. But I suppose such situations should be quite rare.

 

What is really sad is that these papers got separated from the swords they belong to. Someone went trough the whole shinsa process and paid a good amount of money to have a sword papered, yet idiotic heirs separated the sword from the paper and the paper ended up selling for next to nothing on ebay.

Probably a lesson about storing paper(s) together with the respective sword...

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Probably a lesson about storing paper(s) together with the respective sword...

 

Which collector's probably do not do in case of theft.

 

Its as if you put your gun permit with the guns in your gun-locker ;)

 

Indeed you are right that my concern here is the mumei papers which could be joined with any generic mumei blade.

 

KM

 

[Edit] I agree with Lee below about the Kicho papers, but new sword buyers often do not know the difference between the grades in papers which exist.

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What is really sad is that these papers got separated from the swords they belong to. Someone went trough the whole shinsa process and paid a good amount of money to have a sword papered, yet idiotic heirs separated the sword from the paper and the paper ended up selling for next to nothing on ebay.

Probably a lesson about storing paper(s) together with the respective sword...

 

They're kicho papers.

The seller/dealer probably found them in the trash after someone threw them out after getting new hozon papers.

Kicho papers are barely worth the paper they're written on and this type of auction just verifies that.

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Thomas,

You have to rub it in again? :glee: :rotfl: :glee:

I believe a Munetsugu was found in a barn....and many other Juyo-to were found in closets. But for every one of those..there are 1000 mediocre junk bought by ppl like me.

Make no mistake....eBay was pretty good about 5 years ago. There was some good stuff listed and careful searches could score. But nowdays people look for misspellings and there are another 10,000 people looking for the same stuff. It is rare I even stop my scrolling to open an eBay auction. Lots of mediocre stuff.

Stephen will tell you that I did ok with one or 2 swords on Gunbroker though.

 

Brian

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That is true Mariusz, but after how many tries? most people spent their time and life buying tickets without winning.

 

Jean,

 

this is precisely what I was saying. The fact that somebody has got an excellent deal on eBay doesn't mean that chances are high.

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There are great deals to be had, if you know what you are looking at and are willing to gamble a bit. Experience is key. That said, I think there are few people with the experience and knowledge to consistently win on Ebay. Of course, you also have to be lucky....

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Damn Thomas, are you ever going to stop bragging about that, give it a rest. :lol: Just kidding, the Gods were smiling on you. Glad for you.

 

Even though I don't care for e-bay, admittedly there are a few good deals on e-bay occasionally. Chris is proof, he has recently made some nice purchases. But how many people buying on e-bay are as knowledgeable as Chris?? I'm guessing not too many.

 

One of my favorite tsuba came from e-bay. Bought it for a song, had no papers, went Tokubetsu Hozon first submission. My only good e-bay experience.

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