Natichu

On 8/22/2025 at 12:24 PM, Toryu2020 said:

There are no better SAGEO than those from Kiryudo...

Silk Sageo,Sazanami-Weaving Single color Iaido Japanese swords Katana – Kiryudo/桐生堂

Many thanks for that link, those are phenomenal!

5 minutes ago, Hokke said:

Its a fair question, however, im more curious how someone makes 100 “very expensive” mistakes. That seems to say a good bit all on its own. IMO, anyone who makes more than 3 “very expensive mistakes” in the same field should probably pause and have a good long look at the genesis of such a failure. 100 is certainly nothing to brag about, if you want to be taken seriously. 

I appreciate there's been some animosity as of late on the board, but I'd implore some civility. Mine was truly a genuine question (or set of questions, more accurately), and having more threads dragged into attacks and ultimately locked furthers none of our pursuit of this hobby. There have been some very insightful posts on this thread and I'd like to see that continue personally. 

I don't mean this as an attack in any way on you @Hokke, and genuinely appreciate your contributions to the board as well. It just seems like tempers are running a bit hot as of late. 

5 hours ago, Rayhan said:

... 

If I had to do it over, I would have saved my money and waited and then gone where I find myself much later in my appreciation and collecting journey, and I would have had a much bigger budget to spare for what I love. In between the Shinkoku and the Hasebe are over a 100 swords I could have not bought, 100 very expensive mistakes to get here. 

... 

 

Many thanks for the interesting thread and the food for thought; as a beginner I very much appreciate it. 

I suppose I have a few questions for you - you say that you would rather have saved to spend more now that you have ended up further in your understanding and collection. But without those 100 some odd purchases, do you think you would have ended up where you are? How many of the mistakes have added meaningfully to your understanding and appreciation? Are there any in particular on reflection you think we're worthwhile even though you've now moved on from them? 

I appreciate many may not have contributed much, and those that have might make for expensive lessons. But I have to imagine they've contributed something in their own right. 

Different dealers for different things I'd imagine. There are some dealers with more economical options. 

Touken Komachi has a lot of entry level options, along with the higher end:

https://www.toukenkomachi.com/index_ja_tachi&katana.html

Seiyudo has their S-Line offerings:

https://world-seiyudo.com/product-category/s-line/

Nippontou has their Reasonable Japanese Sword section:

https://www.nipponto.co.jp/swordlist0.htm

At the end of the day, lots to be had, but it all depends on what a person's expectations are. Papered katana in good polish under $2000 US? Probably not. But a shorter blade, and/or some tolerance for wear and tear, and there are options out there it seems. 

(Note: of the three I only have experience with Touken Komachi, who have been phenomenal to deal with.)

14 hours ago, nulldevice said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Based on the sugata it seems quite old, and it reminds me of the Doujigiri somewhat so I'm going Ko-Hoki or Ko-Bizen (distinct koshizori and what looks like maybe some midare utsuri?), preferring the former to the latter.  

 

Still having issues with the text boxes, but piggybacking off another post to see if that will work. Contents of the hidden text box are my own, and I don't mean to attribute them to @nulldevice. 

I'll leave it to the more knowledgeable members to chime in, but the one thing that jumps out at me is how little ha-machi is left. My very limited understanding is that isn't usually a good indicator when it comes to blade health (though some flexibility is likely necessary there given the age). The thin kasane and light weight given the length may indicate plenty of past polishes, but I may be wrong on what one should expect for the era. 

Along with all of the excellent recommendations above, I'd add:

For Kyoto - check out Okochi Sanso. Well worth the 1000 yen entrance fee, as it helps escape the crowds. In addition, a trip to Fushimi Inari is well worth your time. 

For Osaka - given that you're there in March, see about attending a day of the March/Spring/Haru sumo basho. Tickets can be tricky to get but there are some good services to assist with that. 

28 minutes ago, Brian said:

Guys, you literally have the English Token Bijutsu issues in the download section...for free.

My apologies if posting the screenshot is an issue, please do delete if it is! 

The translation that Reinhard mentions:

An absolutely stunning piece! Any chance you happen to have the measurements for the motohaba and sakihaba? You'll have to forgive the necropost, I'm delving more into Shinshinto and so searching through older threads. If you ever decide you'd like to part with this one Gary, please do let me know. 

3 hours ago, steve0 said:

Shinshinto are more geared towards the art then battle use IMHO, so some schools and smiths really flexed their talents in making very beautiful blades. That said, I like Shinto a little more as they were more often made to cut men down.

Interesting, I had the rather opposite impression, with my thought being koto as king in terms of designed for use (along with keicho shinto), then shinshinto, and then shinto itself.  Clearly more reading to do for me! 

3 hours ago, Curran said:

Good very old school multi generational shop.

4th gen now?

Several of you are giving very good advice.

 

So far, I agree.   Nagoya >> Kyoto > Tokyo

More shops in Tokyo here and there, but you sort of get that greasy used car lot feel from Aoi Arts. They are not as they were 20-30 years ago.

 

Some of the very very best, and a lot of the worst, are located in Tokyo.

@MEENag   good luck.  Though it may be confusing, the others are trying to help. It is a shame there isn't a strong central organized club in Texas these day.

Things shift, so you will have to rely on internet groups a bit more.

Any particular shops in Nagoya you'd recommend? 

Good evening all, 

Having focused my reading primarily on koto works so far, I've recently started seeing a few shinshinto blades that have caught my eye. So for the shinshinto afficianados among us, I thought I'd ask what is it about shinshinto works that got you interested in them? And importantly, any resources you recommend for more in depth discussions of the period and the break from the shinto tokuden? 

Any insights or stories would be very much appreciated! 

8 minutes ago, Bosco said:

I’m acquiring this blade at the moment. Will see what it’s like in person. It’s very beefy and healthy for its age.

Interesting! If it's the one I'm thinking of I had been eyeing it for a while but never could bring myself to pull the trigger. Very glad to hear it would be going to a forum member and that we might get to see more pictures! 

38 minutes ago, Bosco said:

Hi Erik. Thank you for your information. I got more info on this sword. 
 

NPO NTHK gave it Yushu Gatana award. Its attributed to Shizu Saburo Kaneuji .

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but those show attribution to (den) Yamato Shizu? Not Kaneuji himself. So number 4 in Darcy's breakdown (though I'm not clear how NTHK vs NBTHK might factor in there). 

I'm intrigued by this as well, so figured I'd try to bump this thread up. My sense is it's likely an overall impression ("vibe of the thing" for those that like The Castle) rather than a fixed ratio or numerical difference. But would love to hear from those with more experience! 

Not in the UK, but I have had Touken Komachi make a couple sword bags for me for a wakizashi in shirasaya and for an iaito. Might be worth shooting them an email.

Information in Japanese here:

https://www.toukenkomachi.com/index_ja_okatanabukuro.html

I very much enjoyed and look forward to any next editions! Thank you! 

Hi Ray, 

If possible, would you mind posting the measurements for this one? 

Thank you! 

I'll let the more knowledgeable folks chime in shortly with the details, but to me that appears to be a tokubetsu kicho certificate for the daisho koshirae (nothing to do with the blades themselves). 

23 minutes ago, Jacques said:

I said in nioi-guchi not in hamon.

Thanks for the clarification; my apologies, I read your post as within the nioiguchi (that is, in the hamon). My misunderstanding. 

30 minutes ago, Toryu2020 said:

B732. Zusetsu Bungo To by Yamada - Japanese sword books and tsuba

Fantastic, thank you very much! 

8 minutes ago, Mike0820 said:

It is ware (forging flaw) and it runs parallel to the hamon. I will take more pictures and show exactly what it is. It does not go through to the other side of the blade either. 

Hopefully someone much more knowledgeable than me will be able to chime in (maybe @Ray Singer can expand on the thread linked above, or @Jacques can flesh things out a little once photos are uploaded). 

My understanding is that while it cannot be repaired, it is not fatal (see:

So long as it is not the hagarami some sources describe as a hagire/crack that turns to run parallel to the edge (caused by impact), but rather a ware (a forging flaw). 

6 hours ago, Jussi Ekholm said:

I have the "Bungo book" and this is the lineage from the Kaimoto smiths. There are few pages of text about them, as well as maybe 10 different swords by Yukinaga smiths in the book.

 

 

Sorens post had excellent graph that I think was probably made by Markus Sesko as it seems to have similar format that he uses, and to me it seems great. I would trust Markus over myself on these things.

 

My personal feeling is that Japanese top level sword appreciation is actually quite narrow minded. Of course I at least like to say I understand a bit why it is like that but I personally follow different view when it comes to swords. You'll just see the top and good level smiths featured in every publication and to me it gets bit boring. I like to find interesting and unknown stuff. But in traditional appreciation I think Takada smiths are seen as quite unimportant.

 

There is Tomoyuki (友行) during Nanbokuchō that is seen as a good smith. Unfortunately In person I have only seen one work attributed to him, National Treasure ōdachi of Ōyamazumi-jinja. It is absolutely spectacular supermassive sword but I have no opinion nor skill to say if the attribution would be correct. After that Nagamori (長盛) during Muromachi and Sadamori (定盛) are pretty much the only better regarded Takada smiths I know on top of my mind. I do think the appreciation gap between Tomoyuki and everyone else in the school is massive.

 

You can search 藤原行長 to find some reference work. There is actually a lot of variation in work.

I've seen the "Bungo Book" mentioned in a few posts, but have not yet seen mention of the title or author to allow me to track down a copy. Any chance you could provide a reference?