Mark Green

For those of you who haven't seen this. http://www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/tsubacastiron.html The primary reason that cast iron was not used in period tsuba from Japan. I would tend to believe Fords example. Why would any tsuba maker even think of making something out of a inferior metal, that could spell death for some sword owner. You wouldn't stay in business long. Some of my friend have said that Copper/shakudo/shibuichi/sinchu are very inferior to iron tsuba. NUTS I say. Take an axe to any of these plates, good luck chopping through any of them. But, even the best cast iron is likely to break. And most kinko tsuba were made for the art. You wouldn't slip on your Goto, to ride off to war. This is not really about proving a negative. There are MANY thousands of period tsuba, but we seem to be having great trouble finding even one example of a period cast iron tsuba. Even among the tsuba made of foreign iron. The evidence is surly mounting. Mark

Thanks Dave, That is very interesting. It may be, that any cast Nanban are of Foreign origin. Or, much later copies. Still no smoking gun has surfaced. Hummmmm?? Master Ford's last word on cast iron tsuba is looking quite plausible. As long as the Jury isn't from FL. cheers, Mark G

Wow, that tsuba was some work. Is it just the one piece of inlay missing? Oh never mind I just looked close at the other pic. Is it lense shaped, inside the rim? Very cool! Can you take some close ups for us please? especially of the missing pieces, and all if possible. Thanks for sharing, Mark G

OK then, So, as far as Namban tsuba go, does anyone have, or seen one that was signed, and dated, by a known Japanese tsuba maker? That would surly clear it up! I know squat about them. I always thought the iron was imported anyway. But, a lot of them sure look cast iron. Mark G

I agree. It seems clear that ferrous metal cast tsuba, were not made, for obvious reasons stated above. Were there some flukes, and experiments? Sure. There always are. Did kettle makers make accurate molds of tsuba to sell to Samurai? Not likely. You see lots of cast tsuba floating around. Post Edo. Likely 20th century. The original Munetoshi tsuba from above, has never been found, has it? What a nice find that would be in Grand Dad's attic. Mark G

I really like that 2nd tsuba. Yes, close pics of tangs a must. Mark G

Hi Gang, Very interesting topic. Just a thought.------ This weekend, while Jesus And I were making iron, we ended up making a small amount of cast iron. That was under a monster bloom. If I had an open mould ready, I could have placed this, not liquid, but very melted plastic like iron, in this mold, and made a tsuba blank. After reading the start of this thread, I went out to the shed to see just how fragile this cast iron was. IT WASN'T! It would likely make a fine tsuba, or at least something different. So, I suppose it is possible that some kettel maker/armorer/want to make a tsuba guy, could have made a few cast iron tsuba that would hold up. I'm not saying, any self respecting samurai would have mounted it. But it could have been done. I have no idea when the iron kettle guys did a lot of work. Seems like some were Edo. Japanese iron would be very much like the iron that I make. The composition of the iron sands are very much like my local ore. The cast iron is not like the western white iron, it is much more like the gray iron or puddling iron made in the early days of iron production in the US. Very high carbon, but not brittle like the white iron, used to cast bath tubs, and sinks. I have no document to prove it one way or another. And IF it was done at all, it was likely very rare for reasons Master Ford stated above, but, It is possible that some guy wanted to make a tsuba out of the metal he was making. I would have, had I known I had this material coming. Just a thought. Mark G

Very nice Shinshinto art piece. It looks like the smith was really trying for that old look, and got there. Very pretty!!! Mark G

Well said Ford. Congrats to all. This was my entry. Dragonfly over the pond. Tamahagane made by Master Rich Chen.

Paint it with nothing! It should repatina in a few decades. These are just pajamas for your sword. Something to protect it. If the sword gets polished one day, it will need a new one anyway. As long as the inside is good, your sword won't care. Mark G

I saw 13 assassins. It is very so-so. Lots of very fake action, once the action begins. About a 2 of 5, as far as samurai movies go.

It looked to me to have classic Higo Zogan. Not that old, or very well taken care of. Mark G

I agree with Guido, Edo-Higo Mark G

Michael, The new pics didn't help much. You need some good pics, with a camera. To me, it looks like a china made sword. It has the classic bad kissaki, and the very common looking nakago, with very drilled small holes, bad habaki. At best, I would say, very late war, bad polish, or just plain altered in some way. It is just too difficult to say from these pics. It is very unlikely that any Japanese soldier was fighting with this in a shira saya. They are not made to be used in a fight. But, I suppose anything is possible. Some close pics of the blade, and that kissaki area, should clear it right up. Find someone with a camera, of even a non iPhone, cell. Those iPhone seem to have the worst cameras. Mark G Just looking closely at the saya pics, I would say the sori on the saya is much more then the sword. I wouldn't think this saya was made for this sword. IMHO

Ultra Rare. The fittings look very nice.

Yes shishi, and peonies, for sure. Is there something on the back? Is this the true color? Looks to be shibuichi maybe. I like it. More pics please.

Sweet!!!

I wonder how many heads it has removed???? Wow!

I love those Ian. Wonderful!!!

Great stuff Gang, Here are my two favorite.

And, of course, sword makers did not have access to these numbers until VERY recently. They had to go from experience, handed down, or learned. Mark G

I suppose the tsuba artist could have been thinking of a Japanese Snow monkey, or Macaque? It is very likely that he never saw a real monkey, and was going from some other tsuba, or old art. Most tsuba artists of the day, never saw any of the creatures they were depicting in their art. Tigers, are not from Japan, but you see many of them in tsuba theme. Most have a common flaw in the placement of their teeth. This is likely because most of the artists were going from old art, or another tsuba, made by someone else whom had never seen a tiger. So, in time, that tooth placement became the norm. And many are very cartoon like. It is the same with monkeys. I have seen at least a dozen of these long arm monkey tsuba. Some with 2 monkeys, others with one. Very few look like real monkeys??? Cheers, Mark G

Jason, The first tsuba is a Gibbon. A common theme.

Actually John, Charleston is in SC. And Pineville is about 3.5 hrs from there. There are a lot of antique stores in downtown Charleston. That town did a lot of china trade before the CW. You never know what you may find. A friend of mine found a tadayoshi, stacked with a bunch of old CW swords in a cane stand once. Mark G Unless of course, you are going to the NC, Charleston. That is a tiny mountain resort town?????

What Dave said.!!! The people setting this up should have handlers. Ask, if the horse is accustomed to the weight, and the armor. Let someone hand your weapons up to you once you are settled. Always have an exit strategy in mind. Have fun! Take many heads. Mark G