Taz575

Neat page! Some nice pictures, but there was a lot of talk about tired blades as well.

I've been enjoying my Shigekuni Wakizashi from Ed over a Yakiba lately and really studying it. One thing I noticed that I have not see in my other blades is that the hada changes near the hamon/edge. It gets much finer towards the edge and less pattern is visible; it makes a clear transition. I don't think it is the hadori finish because in some areas, it happens above the hadori finish. The grain becomes much finer and harder looking, but doesn't look like when softer core steel is exposed. It looks like it may be a san mei or other laminate construction with the hard steel at the edge, softer along the sides/back? Almost all of the videos I have seen were a kobuse type of forging with the softer core steel wrapped in the harder outer steel, but this seems to be the opposite with the harder edge core and softer outer panels. I think one of the Youtube videos I have seen shows this type of construction? Ed has some great pictures that show what I am talking about better than my pictures can! Long sunagashi is present as well, which I read somewhere may be an indication of a laminate type of construction where it is the lamination line possibly? In the case of this wakizashi, the line doesn't match up with the hada pattern change so I am not sure if I believe that?? In my Japanese Kitchen knife experience, there is a clear line that marks the cladding/core steel and the steels react differently to the same stone (core gets shiny, softer cladding gets a matte finish) but with the wakizashi, it looks different. Some Japanese kitchen knife smiths use a layer of nickel to prevent carbon migration, one of them even used Copper between the hard core steel and softer cladding! With this one, the steel just seems to change, but near the ha machi and on other areas, the change doesn't seem to happen as high up the blade. Does anyone else have any pictures of blades where they can see the construction methods like this one? Or any pictures of a laminated blade to compare this one to? I always thought the san mai (or other lamination types) were the popular choice for Japanese swords, but most seem to be the Kobuse method with soft core, hard outsides.

Wak came back today! Wally Hostetter did the work: Saya repaired, kozuka pocket filled, re lacquered in gloss black instead of dark brown, shirasaya done. New tsuka, same, dark blue ito, new habaki, seppa, fit tsuba to blade. Koshirae has a tsunagi so I can display it:

Thanks Peter! I spent time on that sight looking yesterday but somehow missed that one! I found a few others online last night; Unique Japan had one a while back in the catalog. It's a shame many of these have a hadori finish that hides the real hamon. The unpredictability of the hamon is what drew me to the blade I got from Ebay, but many of the pics I have found show an undulating midare ba hamon pattern and not the details.

It's the wak from the post I did a while back about my first Ebay wak. http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/19395-first-real-wakizashitrying-to-find-info-out-about-it/ I will get some new pics of the new tsuka, habaki, seppa and repaired saya from Wally Hostetter and the shirasaya as well when it arrives!

Anyone have info about this smith? I have the info from Markus Sesko's book: MASATOSHI (正俊), Kanbun (寛文, 1661-1673), Yamashiro – “Heianjō-jū Fujiwara Masatoshi” (平安城住藤原 正俊), “Heianjō Ishidō Masatoshi” (平安城石道正俊), “Heianjō Ishidō Ukon Masatoshi” (平安城石道右近正俊), real name Ishidō Ukon (石堂右近), he came originally from Kii province where he belonged to the Kishū-Ishidō school, he was according to tradition the son or a student of Sukeyuki (助行), he accompanied Sukeyuki to Yamashiro, itame mixed with masame, midare-utsuri appears, the hamon is a chōji-midare mixed with tobiyaki, a gunome-chōji or a suguha, chūjō-saku Markus and Mike were able to check out my first Wak at the Orlando show and Mike thinks this is the smith of mine! I guess Mike had heard of these type of yasurime, but hadn't seen them in person before. Anyone have other info about this smith? I found a blade of his on ShoShin and Markus found an Oshigata and one of his blades that sold on a Japanese website. Most of what I have found online is the Etchu no Kami Masatoshi, not the later Heianjo Masatoshi.

Nope..only did the $50 insurance because USPS never pays out anyway.

Well, looks like USPS lost the package on its way for a window polish

Yeah, me too!

Tissue will often shred, even paper towels would shred on me unless I used the Goo Gone stuff.

I used to make custom handles for Japanese kitchen knives. I would always masking tape the blade and had to deal with this residue on many blades, including carbon blades like the White and Blue series steels, ones with iron cladding, etc. Try a micro fiber cloth and the alcohol. The tape should make the mf cloth grab a bit and may take some pressure to remove and several tries and more alcohol than you would think. Goo Gone worked great and didn't discolor the carbon kitchen knife blades, but I would be extremely hesitant to use it on a sword.

It almost looks like masking tape residue?? Is Goo Gone safe to use on Nihonto?? I doubt it since it is a citrus based cleaner, but it works great at removing adhesive residues. More alcohol and elbow grease may be in order??

I am interested in the Tsunami Tiger product reception as well. They are marketed as cutting blades, not as nihonto, but the colors/themes and stuff seem a bit odd. Not much online about them yet? I think this was to be their first major show, but one of the guys was sick or something the first day?

Link doesn't work? Is it in a closed group? I did find some pictures from Orlando Battadou fb page...looks like an awesome show!!

Can you share or shoot me a link to your photos? I am stuck at work by my sword is down there with Wally Hostetter, so I have to live vicariously thru pics!

FB link? I checked around and couldn't find any pics yet?? Is SGJ a person or business page on FB?

Where do you see pics?

That is a beautiful blade and an awesome deal! Unfortunately, I am tapped out at the moment after the Shigekuni I got from Ed recently and need to rebuild funds, otherwise I would be snapping up yours in a heartbeat!!

I did check out the naginatanaoshi, but it didn't appeal to me; I like interesting Hamon/Hataraki/Hada. The other wasn't listed when I got this one, but looks to be in worse shape than mine polish wise when I looked at it quickly on my phone, need to look at the pics on a computer with a bigger screen. I may even just have a window or two opened on this blade to study and not even have the entire blade polished. That way it's not a lot of extra money to invest in it so I can study it and enjoy it, it will let me know if it's worth it to polish more and how much polishing it will need so I can determine what to do. That will most likely be step 1, window polish. I've been eying a few on AoiJapan; I wanted that wak they had for 100,000 Yen that was signature unconfirmed, but it got put on hold by the first time I saw it. I was about to get Mumei-7 on there (Showa blade with nice hamon that needed a polish), but went to the Shigekuni instead, which tapped me out last weekend and now that one is on hold, too. The classifieds here is a multiple time a day check in for me; there are some awesome deals there!!!

Brian and others, I appreciate the honest info. I know polishing it isn't worth it in your guys opinions, but from what I can see and the purpose of the blade to me, at least a finish polish is worth it to see the structures better. My original concern was that I didn't want to have a high end blade messed up even more than it was currently if it had a decent chance at a high end blade. I don't think this one is. Moving the mne machi forward would have covered the polishing issue (don't care about the kizu, but with being flat, it would be difficult for the next polisher to polish the remainder of the blade). I didn't want to do that to a high end blade. Probably still won't since it would need some new fitting at that point, too. I wish I could get better pictures for you guys. The Ebay pics are with a coating of dried oil and when I first got it, the hamon wouldn't even pop under the right lighting. Once I got most of that dried oil layer off, the hamon pops nicely in the lighting, but there isn't much contrast that is able to be seen between the hamon and hada unless the lighting is perfect. Taking a picture is even harder. I was hoping for a wak with a sanbonsugi hamon, which it is and a different hada than what I had currently. I have some extra disposable income and have been wanting to get examples of different hamons, different hada, different hataraki, different schools, etc for my study blades. So it fits that purpose and is worth it to me to have it cleaned up a little so I can see the hamon and hada better. Full restoration, no. I took some measurements last night of it. 26mm wide at the munemachi, ha machi is barely present still. Shinogi is 7mm thick, kasane is 6.3mm thick. At the kissaki, 4.3mm kasane, just under 19mm wide. Weight is 432 grams, Nagasa is around 43.7cm. Sori is just over 1cm, looks to be tori sori. The nagasa gets thicker as it gets closer to the kasane, goes to over 7.5mm at the shinogi before it tapers back near the mekugi ana.

For my blade? I am not going for a full restore/papering, but I am guessing over 5K is what to expect for a papering $600 at least with shipping, registration, fees, etc), polish ($2K) and koshirae ($3K from Unique Japan) from Japan. I was debating it when some features pointed to a higher smith and reading on here about not sending a good blade to a US self trained polisher. I was thinking a real Japanese Master Togi would be able to look at the blade currently and the kizu and make a better decision/evaluation than I could about where to go from here with it and what my options were if it was a higher end blade to have it taken care of correctly rather than send it to someone non Japanese trained in the US and have it trashed. When you read about US polishers on the forum, basically everyone says if they weren't trained in Japan, they are good for gendaito or showato only and not older blades. Since this may be an older blade and from the little I can see in the blade in person (very difficult for me to photograph), I was considering taking advantage of Kunitaro's service and have it sent to Japan for a better look and evaluation and go from there if it warranted it. If I can get the blade cleaned up and the tarnish off, I would debate getting a modern koshirae done for it to pass down to my nephews, but that would be many years away! If people on here thought it was a decent blade and may be worth it to take the time and effort to have it checked out professionally in Japan, I was OK with that since I don't have much money invested in it currently. A trip there and back for an eval wouldn't kill my budget and would give me a better idea of how to proceed from here to prevent myself from messing up a very good blade if that was the case. But that doesn't seem to be the way to go, which is why I wanted to check in to that before doing it. There is little contrast visible in the polish between jigane and hagane, which make pictures hard to show what I can see in proper lighting. In hand and the right light, I like what I can see, which is limited. The rust isn't deep or red; its more age tarnish and most can't be felt. A final stage type polish, like Hofhine does for under $600, would most likely let me see the hamon much better and the differences between jigane and hagane so I could study the blade more. From what I can see, the hamon is a nice, thick, soft nioi guchi and has kinsuji/inazuma down at least 2/3 of the length of the blade, some parts has multiple lines of it from what I can see currently. There is lots of ko ashi, too. For me, for a study type blade, I will usually go up to $1000 for one in shirasaya, $1500 in decent Koshirae. Since I am $400 in to this one only, I have some extra to get it cleaned up as from what I can see in hand that is difficult to see in the pics, it will be very nice when polished, but will most likely get done by a US polisher, not a real Japanese one to stay in my budget. I wanted to get several "study blades" to start with and several books before I jump in deeper and wanted to have at least 4 real Wakizashi to pass down to my nephews when they turn 18, and still have blades left for me to enjoy. The Shigekuni Wak this weekend was a bit earlier than I had planned on getting into a worthy blade, but it was in my budget and I loved the activity I could see in it. It will also show me a great polish and I can compare that to the others I have here. A couple of thin strips of masking tape on the mune side of the saya mouth did wonders for tightening the fit up, so that problem is solved for about $.01. HXV, I would be interested, but with the Shigekuni Wak purchase, property taxes, and a week of training I need to go to next month, I need another couple of months of behaving spending wise before I could spring for your blade! You can PM me some info, but I gotta get some $$ saved up first.

I understand what you guys are saying and I appreciate it. No trip to Japan then. HXV, I got the Shigekuni Wak from Yakiba this weekend for $2K, signed, papered and with Koshirae and Shirasaya because the seller wanted to move it fast; price was originally $3500 I usually browse several sites besides Ebay (Nihonto.us, Nihontoantiques, Ricecracker, AoiJapan, Japanesesword.com, Nihonto.com, etc) almost daily to look for items around the $2K mark. It's rare to find a papered, signed, no flaws wak in Koshirae that does not need a polish at the 2K mark from what I have seen over the past few months. Most are around 3-4K. There are some mumei non papered waks under 2K, but most need at least a finish polish, if not more and aren't signed/papered/flawless. Any other sites I should add to my daily view list?? Like my first 2 ebay waks, I was looking for a cheap wak to invest a little into to get it polished where the hamon/hada was interesting to me and different than my current study blades. This one fit the bill for me. I will get it polished eventually so I can see more of the activity because that is why I got it in the first place, but will keep it otherwise as is. It may only need a final polish to let me see the activity better; I am not trying to return it to a pristine shape and repair each flaw/spot. The Shigekuni Wak will be my first "real" collectors type blade.

Ok. For me, the money spent on a better polish to remove the rust and see the activity better (the existing polish is shiny, but has issues: ripples down the hamon line where the hard and soft steels meet, yokote is wonky, kissaki is badly done, etc) is worth it since that is the whole reason to buying this blade. The wood habaki doesn't hold the blade end of the shirasaya on at all; it just falls off, so I want to get that re done with a real metal habaki and have that fit better to the shirasaya. I could shim the saya I guess? If I don't shorten anything, Habaki/Polish isn't too bad; shortening the blade would mean new shirasaya as well, which adds to the cost, so I am leaning to keeping the flaw there and not trying to cover it (leave it in original condition, just have it polished, metal Habaki maybe?). I was going to use Josiah Boomershine in the US for the polish and habaki issue since that is less hassle than the Japanese overseas paperwork route. Polish and habaki IMHO aren't options (which is why I didn't go high on the bidding!), the option is who to go to. It would at least let me get a better idea of the features of the sword so I could decide which way to go. I will see if I can shim up the saya opening a bit to make the habaki fit tighter. Since I can't see much hada/hamon/boshi in this blade in the current condition, but from what little I can see, it's very nice! It's difficult to kantei to see if it's worth the money or not for the Japanese route due to the state of the blade. With the flaw, I am leaning towards no, but I wanted to check here first since people here have more experience than I do and I don't want to send a high end blade to a non traditional polisher in the US for work like this and find out later I really botched a high end blade.

Interesting info! I heard back from the seller, bought from Japan, no papers, gun show sword guy thought it was Kanemoto, so I am going to basically ignore that theory! Prob saw the sanbonsugi and went to the most famous maker. I noticed all of the Kanemoto posts recently and decided to look in to it; some fits, some doesn't. Forgot to mention, I used my uchiko ball on this a few times and the hamon/hada is a bit more clear each time I do so, so I will do a few more and try to get better pics. Under the rust flecks/spotting, the blade is very polished; shinogi ji is highly burnished. When I first got it, the hamon didn't really pop even with an older incadescent light bulb, after the uchiko treatment, the hamon pops under the incandescent light like it should. I am debating sending it to Japan via Kunitaro for a check up, polish, maybe habaki and shirasaya and shinsa if it looks good for it. Since I only have $400 into this one, I think it is interesting enough to take some time and $$ to get it checked out in Japan. I was going to use one of the US polishers, but this one may need a trip overseas.

That's the Ebay listing for it. That is all the info I have to go on for it. I sent the seller a message to see if they have any other info/paperwork about it, so thanks for that idea! Got it mainly for the hamon pattern like my other 2 Ebay waks. The polish condition makes it hard to see the hamon/activity, so I want to get it cleaned up polish wise at least to see more of the activity; should look great polished! I wasn't sure if the flat spot would make it more difficult to polish it since it kinda flattens out. The kissaki isn't all that well polished, and the yokote line is angled in different directions, so I don't think it was "professionally polished" as the ad claims, especially with the kizu area issue!