Lance

Looks similar to   koshi-no-hiraita gunome-midare, usually associated with late koto,-early shinto Shinto  Bizen Yokoyama Sukesada smiths.

Regards,

Lance

Dark area in between  whitish area is likely just  from thumb pressure and abrasive  qualities of uchiko. 

Regards,

Lance 

Your welcome, out of curiosity how long is the blade? Proportions wise it loos like a waizashi?

Regards,

Lance

Full mei is Noshu seki ju Kanefusa, I believe,

https://www.aoijapan.net/wakizashi-noshu-seki-ju-kanefusa/

Regards,

Lance

Lance,

 

the thread is almost three years old - should be enough time to get the HABAKI off, I hope. 

Hahaha,  sorry, It was meant for the  topic below,  

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/31971-niji-mei-kanemoto-info/

This is what happens when  multiple tabs are open looking for information.  Others already provided my recommendations  so all's well that ends well.

Regards,

Lance

Provided a pic of tool others mentioned above, place long side of wood against blade striking downward on front of habaki with wooden mallett.  Solder will make this more difficult though.  

Might be worth trying to contact someone  like  Bob Benson in Hawaii to remedy it.  I don't know what he'd charge you but you could  probably get some input  on the mei and sword itself  from him  at the same time.  

https://bushidojapaneseswords.com/index.html

Also Ted Tenold who's a member here might be able to provide guidance as well and  I believe he  resides in California too.  

http://www.legacyswords.com/about.html

Regards,

Lance

Hi Reggie,

San Francisco show would be a good idea, I believe it's one of the biggest sword shows in the US and there should be plenty of knowledgeable people there. 

Regards,

Lance  

Hi Ken, I've submitted a couple swords that weren't in full polish  that passed, and  and seen many other swords in the US  with NTHK papers,  in person and on dealer sites in similar condition,    If I had to guess I think most swords submitted to the NTHK shinsas held in the US, the bulk are probably not freshly polished.  The point level might be less than fully restored  but it's a cost effective way to get a judgement  to help decide if a polish and shira saya is worth it.  I don't think the standards lowered so much as they saw a need  (or opportunity) to help US collectors (and US dealers)  put more swords in front of knowledgeable eyes that  might not ordinarily get sent to Japan.  

Regards,

Lance

Looks to be a well made sword, nice overall shape and bohi,  I'd be happy finding it for such a price as a shin gunto example.

I don't know where you live but it looks like it's in good enough condition to submit to one of the NTHK shinsa next time (if) they hold one in the US. 

Another thing to consider for your own enjoyment,  "out of the woodwork swords"  weren't always stored properly,  so just a couple months of oil and light cleaning on a blade that hasn't seen any oil for decades can make a big difference.  Apply oil, clean off (maybe use uchiko)  and reapply oil  when you take it out to study/look at,   I've picked up swords at gun shows or flea markets and after after a couple weeks a  blade that seemed somewhat "gray" brightened up and features more visible,  even without uchiko.  

Regards,

Lance

I can't prove it, but I think they had to of used nugui or something similar to get such a contrast between the body of the sword and the white of the hamon, without doing all the extra work that would otherwise remove the scratches from previous steps.

Regards,

Lance

To me it looks like the ji  (space between shinogi and hamon) wasn't darkened fully when it was polished,  usually done with  Nugui, an oil with (I believe) iron oxides in it.   Wartime polishers, especially for Showa-to didn't spend the same amount of time with the finishing work,  and/or weren't as skilled as traditionally trained togi so you sometimes end up with stuff that  looks a little different polish wise.   

Regards,

Lance

 My understanding is you will never see  the remnants of an old hamon on a re hardened sword, as before a new one is created  the blade is heated and allowed to cool naturally.  This removes the old hamon, both functionally and visibly.  (I think this is also when the grain takes on the looser and glassy look,from multiple expansion contraction and change in carbon content) 

  From the photos it just  looks like the polisher didn't consistently follow the hamon, so the peaks aren't as white as the the rest when using  hazuya finger stones, 

http://www.ksky.ne.jp./~sumie99/utsuri.html

 As an aside, maybe I just haven't seen enough swords or my logic is faulty,  but I  don't think there are as many re-tempered swords out there as people believe.  It seems to me any swords that were really important  and worth the effort are already very  rare, (for example blades made by Koto masters damaged in a fire  that were given to Echizen Yasatsugu and re tempered  for the Shogun)

Any munitions grade swords for ashigaru  or even mid level blades were probably scrapped, and not worth digging through the rubble after a  castle fire, and any that were reworked during a campaign due to battle wear saw attrition through just being used up.   

Regards,

Lance

If the tops of the hamon  loop around, possibly koshi-no-hiraita gunome-midare?

From Markus Sesko's Blog;

Towards the end of the Muromachi period, the trend of a more complex gunome was still forwarded what resulted in the case of the Sukesada line in the so-called „kani no tsume“ (蟹の爪), the famous „crab claws“, where individual koshi-no-hiraita gunome-midare elements open towards the top and end in chôji-yakigashira which remind as the name suggests of crab claws (see picture 6).

Picture 5: katana of Gorôzaemon Kiyomitsu (五郎左衛門清光) dated Tenbun 24 (1555)

Picture 6: Schematic representation of a Sue-Bizen-hamon with kani-no-tsume. We can easily see how the isolated yô of the Ôei-Bizen smiths become again dividing elements on nioi basis (i.e. ashi) and give so a further complexity to the koshi-no-hiraita gunome-midare.

https://markussesko.com/2013/03/13/a-brief-outline-of-the-changes-in-workmanship-of-the-later-bizen-tradition/

Regards,

Lance

I'm sure there was some over generalization (and exaggeration too) What Ive always found to be really interesting in these accounts is their impressions of us, we (westerners) must have been as weird to them as they to us, or maybe we were even stranger to them, at least we were in contact with China beforehand.

Regards,

Lance

Chris J (Vajo) mentioned Mino Shinto, maybe Kanefusa? 

kenbō-midare (兼房乱れ) – A kind of large-dimensioned chōji-midare that goes back to the smith Kanefusa (兼房). Kenbō is the Sino-Japanese reading of the characters “Kanefusa.”

https://markussesko.com/2015/06/04/kantei-3-hamon-boshi-1-2/

(image and text from Markus Sesko's blog)

Regards,

Lance 

Couple short videos  about early/first contact from different perspectives

Regards,

Lance

Just noticed some of Aoi Arts'  listings have YouTube videos included, pretty neat. 

link to channel below; 

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP7r6ZvJ-8zkPlc_Zuv0liA

Regards,

Lance

Thought I'd share some pics of a  humorous kogai I mentioned very briefly in another post;  by Yasuyuki , I believe Hamano school.of naughty horses (has NBTHK papers but didn't take a  a shot of them) 

  And to compliment others on their excellent photography  skills, I hadn't done it in a while and forgot how tough it is. 

Regards,

Lance 

No problem Dave, I just wish whoever did  it just had a new tsuka made instead of adding a new hole to the  tang. 

Regards,

Lance

Anything done was most likely at least 1 other person away from me before any alterations were made;   I did some "almost" literal horse trading  for a nice (but sort of naughty) horse  kogai and other fittings with a dealer/collector I was friendly with somewhere within a year of that post.  I doubt he altered anything as he wasn't a mix and match kind of person.    If it was him, he would most likely have just had new tsuka made with the old fittings after sourcing tsuba and seppa without adding a new ana.

Regards,

Lance  

Mei is Kanetsugu, It almost looks like the same sword I posted some years ago and someone messed with it a bit between the time I had it and it madecits way to you:addition of an extra mekugi ana and (unless its just a lighting difference) darkened the recessed portions of the horimono? When I had it, or the one I had by same smith everything that wasn't burnished had a frosted appearance. Also if I remember correctly the wrap had some fraying so someone may have swapped tsuka and added tsuba and seppa, that would explain the extra hole.

Or its another sword by the same smith with almost exact horimono, See post below:

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/11756-help-with-gendaito-signature-request/

Regards,

Lance

My impression was also that Japan never really made large metal  plates for armor like Europeans    and their fighting styles, tactics, and terrain etc. made lamellar or scale armor preferable. 

What I really always wondered was why they didn't use shields like Europeans did,  then someone pointed out that their early armor had two giant shields on their shoulders.   

Different cultures coming up with different solutions to the same question? 

Regards,

Lance 

Thanks all, curiosity satisfied (although I'd love to see any other examples if there are any)

Best regards

Lance

Hi all, after seeing another post I remembered  this odd tang shape  and I was wondering if anybody had or seen any actual examples  out in the wild? 

Gohei Gata

They seem to be very uncommon but stainless/anti rust blades in gunto mounts with learther saya, do pop up occaisonally, and I believe (for whatever that's worth) they were purchased and carried in the field rather than post war mix and matches. No pics but some years back I had a couple in shin gunto mounts, one had better qualitiy furniture with two hangers, the other a single hanger. Both with leather coverings too. At least one was the anti rust type made by Kanenaga and appeared to have a real hamon, very thin light Nioguchi, different than an oil creaeed hamon but not quite the same as water hardened. Everything fit well and seemed to have proper wear in the leather to suggest they saw use.

Regards,

Lance