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I was thinking it was some kind of tool/device used in dyeing kimono fabrics. They used to wash kimono fabric in cold river waters to "set" the dye. But, it doesn't look like a drying table or dyeing table (like the one below), which is kind of close, but somehow not right. The one on the tsuba looks like some implement used to roll up fabric. Anyway, my guess is some device used in silk weaving or dyeing/washing. https://icac.or.jp/public/culture/tool/

Not true. I've seen this sword in hand and I can say emphatically, this photo is a good representation of the quality of workmanship the blade exudes. What is true is that photos are only as good as the photographer and his equipment, as this example demonstrates. The midare utsuri is just as vivid in hand as it is in the image, as is the nioiguchi in the hamon.

Kris: As a leather worker, I would be careful with natural oils like mink oil because they can darken leather. Neatsfoot oil MIGHT darken the leather but usually doesn't. Another option are conditioners used on high-end purses, like Coach conditioner. Bick also makes a good conditioner. Personally, I use either Coach leather conditioner or Neatsfoot. John C.

The box clearly says Sanzui-Zu - but if silk dyeing or weaving is involved could it be the subject is Tanabata?

A recent acquisition. I thought the gold hirazogan inlay was rather nice and reminded me of some of the work of Umetada Myoju (rightly or wrongly) and the Umetada school in general (but perhaps a bit “stiffer”?) The inlay is done with remarkable precision and has a bit of a katakiribori painterly style about it. It seems exceptionally heavy in hand for its size suggesting a good quality shakudo plate. Out of interest, if the gold content in the shakudo was just 5% that alone would be nearly £700 at todays values! The maker, Tohdo (Ozaki Tohdo) is an Edo period artist around 1775-1800 per Haynes and he had some obvious talent. Hirazogan is generally regarded as a more demanding technique than Takazogan. There is no room for even minor errors as they become clearly evident when the smooth flush surface receives its final polishing. Anyone else see Umetada influences?….or am I barking up the proverbial tree?

On paper it's easy, but with a sword in hands it's a different story. Can you see the subtlety? I can't. I haven't yet reached that level of knowledge. As for those who claim to judge the quality of a sword based on a few photos, give me a break.

Kris. I am not familiar with Mink Oil but I have always used Renapur ...best thing since sliced bread. Search "everywhere" on NMB for RENAPUR and you will pick up a lot of info on that plus other dressings.

There was some interest in Ainu blades so I'll post a couple images. There are three typical Ainu blades, belt knives, bush knives, and then real swords. Most blades in all three categories were recycled Japanese blades. Some few were repurposed "nippon-to" but most look like utilitarian cutlery. What makes then "Ainu" is the fittings that got once they were in Ainu hands.There were also some few blades that are called "Yezo-to" that seem to have been forged either by Ainu smiths or at least up in Hokkaido to Ainu standards. These are not edge tempered or mounted like Nippon-to and they're pretty rare. I have one. It is shown as Ainublade3 . These swords always seem to have had very fragile fittings. I include a picture of a book that some might find or interest. Peter

I am late to this thread and will have to read it in more depth to see if I can add any value. For now, here is one I have owned for a while. Thought it has gotten some surprising interactions out of tsuba scholars smarter than me, I have never inquired too much.

Hi Sukaira, It’s a well forged Ko-Minara blade. In the grand scheme of Nihonto, the school is considered provincial, as can be seen in its characteristic “rustic” jihada, and this is a low ranking Juyo blade, all else considered. Juyo Ko-Mihara mumei blades are plentiful. Seasoned collectors do not seek out these blades. For this crowd, if there is interest in Ko-Mihara, at all, It is preferable to find a signed blade from this school, or at least - one attributed to a specific master, Masaie or Masahiro come to mind. While this advice may seem curious today, but given time, you’ll come to appreciate it, as I have. Now does this mean the blade is “bad” ? Not at all. It is a remarkably good example of the Ko-Mihara school. However, it is good in the context of the Ko-Mihara school, as it has outcompeted other Ko-Mihara blades in a given session. As others have said, at the end what matters is that it speaks to the you - but don’t neglect “future” you. If you maintain your interest in learning in this field, this particular sword will be less interesting to future you than current you. At this price point, you have many options, a very interesting place in terms of possibilities for “future” you. The biggest mistake you can make is to “buy too much too quickly” in this field. You need to give yourself time to grow. I hope this help, -Hoshi

Hi Jake, This is the one signed Yoshiomi, it has the Nagoya Arsenal stamp and is dated November in the 18th year of Showa. The fittings look better than standard gunto fittings and the tachi mei also adds interest. I’m still not 100% sure that the two sides of the tang photographed are of the same blade: the colour is different and the hand of the inscription doesn’t match for me, however, I’m not a military swords guy but these gentlemen can help: @mecox @Bruce Pennington @PNSSHOGUN

Could that be SHODO equipment in the foreground? I think I can see a SUMIBACHI with an ink stick. Representing a poet or a painter at work in the beauriful landscape?

Yes, I agree. Definitely getting better by the day. There are a few errors in the character recognition, but its surprisingly good, given the handwritten and slightly faded nature of the source. @Deez77 I wouldn't call that 草書体. Just typical handwriting. Translation at the link below. https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/53956-help-please-with-inscription-on-tsuba-box/?do=findComment&comment=565372

Recent acquisition, a shakudo piece with a tranquil design depicting what? I would guess something to do with textile dyeing/production….washing silk in the stream? but I cannot think of any specific “legend” or story that relates. Maybe for a posh silk merchant’s wakizashi? Very heavy for its size suggesting decent quality shakudo. Any other suggestions? Mei is “Shokodo Mitsuchika” and I’ve asked in translation section for help with the lid inscription.

I have collected c. 80% of the Jūyō books and for statistical nerd like me they are worth their weight. Most important thing for me are the actual cm measures of the swords, they allow me to create a good mental image of each sword. However I couldn't really say much about those swords quality wise by just reading the entries from the book. There are many things that make me scratch my head but I must just agree that the experts know so much than me and their view is much more valid than mine. I tried to look into Ichige Norichika as unfortunately I am compeletely clueless about that smith. I believe he is sometimes regarded as the best Mito swordsmith by experts. His contemporary Naoe Sukemasa also has similarish Jūyō record 6 passes between sessions 17-27 and then 2 passes 41 & 42, while Ichige Norichika has 5 passes in sessions 17-25. Their teacher Ozaki Suketaka has 3 passes in 14-20 and 1 sword passed in session 63. Now for some older Jūyō sessions NBTHK gave out very detailed submission and pass numbers in their magazine. Here I will focus on the very large sessions 23,24,25,26, that have fairly large submission numbers and extremely high overall pass rate. So lot of Jūyō items in these sessions. It might not be known that well but during this time NBTHK gave Kotō and Shintō submission numbers. Session 23 Kotō 557 submitted and 337 passed - Shintō 364 submitted and 156 passed -> so Kotō has 61% pass rate and Shintō has 43% Session 24 Kotō 590 submitted and 356 passed - Shintō 428 submitted and 127 passed -> so Kotō has 60% pass rate and Shintō has 30% Session 25 Kotō 450 submitted and 250 passed - Shintō 369 submitted and 91 passed -> so Kotō has 56% pass rate and Shintō has 25% Session 26 Kotō 366 submitted and 282 passed - Shintō 211 submitted and 88 passed -> so Kotō has 77% pass rate and Shintō has 42% I know people have done pass rate calculations etc. as many would want to "beat" the game and get the maximum amount of info would be helpful in this. However NBTHK stopped giving out the submission numbers for Kotō and Shintō and just had overall number for swords from session 29 onwards. Roughly from 29 to 39 sessions the number of swords submitted in overall reached c.1500 swords per shinsa session and only between 8% to 15% items in overall passing. So pretty radical change was made at that time.

Look at the mei and the shinogi line in the nakago. I would still call fake. If not...then the whole nakago was ground down poorly and a new poor mei added. Not something anyone would want to own.

I want to hint to the plants on the reverse: on the left is hagi (bush clover), on the right we see silver grass or obana, both connected with the end of summer and the beginning of fall. The motif on the rolled up fabric comprising a dragonfly and apparently nanakusa (seven herbs), also autumnal symbols. Maybe this time of year helps to indentify the strange tool?

The videos are a big improvement. One of the biggest drawbacks of photos, is you tend to need so many - to see detail across the sword, different angles and lighting etc. I'd say it's possible to get some indication from photos, but there's usually a lot of detail that's easy to miss. Just look at the sellers that are able to take selective photos to mask flaws etc.

I think you're right, Conway. The blade looks Japanese. Very faint 'feather' yasurime visible on the undated date side if you zoom in. Highly buffed, acid washed. The fittings look like late war, low quality stuff, and the mei .... I have seen discussions of legit old blades with ugly mei, so I know they exist, but we'd need some of the nihonto guys like @Ray Singer to give us a look. When you zoom in, you can see the mei was chiseled in with many small taps.

Very attractive workmanship and subject. I also think this represents an indigo dyeing scene under moonlight with the final bolt of fabric on a roller.

Real, antique but nothing special. Poor condition with lots of grain openings. Nothing worth grabbing unless it's dirt cheap

Hello Mark. Yes, it's still available

Bit more research……..I think it probably is silk dyeing in the moonlight. My kind of romantic subject! Just behind the hut can be seen what might be some sort of bamboo drying (?) frame…a bit dilapidated? Apart from admiring the actual craftmanship, there is much fun to be had in trying to figure the subjects, yes? Thanks to you all.

Dead on I'd say. Grain and color on my piece where not hidden by tar and grime are identical.

Hi @Jake007, I have relocated some of the more obvious fakes to the "Fake Japanese Sword" section linked here: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/forum/142-fake-Japanese-swords/ I suspect a couple of the others may also be fakes, but I have left them here for now so members have the opportunity to weigh in. I have to agree with the above, that this is not the best way to feel out a purchase. Many Japanese sword collectors have their "finger on the pulse" of these auction sites, and while it might seem like there are deals to be had, those deals are usually only found by those with a trained and educated eye. I'd recommend reading up a bit, looking into some books, and doing some study before a purchase. As an entry, I really like "The Art of the Japanes Sword" by Leon and Hiroko Kapp and Yoshindo Yoshihara. Also the "Connoisseurs book of Japanese swords" by Kokan Nagayama is very often recommended and is a great resource. Your dime your time of course; but you may encounter many pitfalls with this approach. All the best, -Sam

Good Morning john, may i offer some advice? the nihonto market is very tight right now, its a buyers market with heaps and heaps to pick from, so really good photos is the main selling point you need to focus on. peaple wont buy if they cant see all the main points. also please bear in mind you compeating with retail dealers so pricing must be competitive. i wish you luck with the move. are you moving counties?? regards H

Mostly wartime swords. But I think #2 and #5, and most likely #4 too...are Chinese fakes.

尚古堂花親 　　　→　　光親 Mitsuchika (art name of Shōkodō, other pronunciations possible, but I think that's the one) 内田家水図 →　　田家山水図　Rural/Pastoral mountain scene 金地錦紋色絵 　　→　　鍔　据紋色絵　　　suemon-iroe describes the metalworking technique of applying a decorative element made from an alloy or other precious metal into a space carved out for it into the base metal. I think the other line (Tatemaru-gata) was already given in the other thread. Edit: I'll put it here for completeness, and because there is an error in the other thread 竪丸型　赤銅地　鍔　Tsuba, oval-shaped, base-metal of shakudō (no kinzōgan).

Haha that's what I figured guy must have been 8 feet tall I'm about 6 feet and this thing is huge. Could you imagine a Japanese officer 100 years ago dragging a giant sword on the ground. Im not sure if people had been smaller back then like they say and Japanese people most are of smaller stature I do not believe anyone would have been able to wear this on a belt and walk around with it lmao

For what it's worth, Chat GPT gives the below... maybe something useful out of it 🤷🏼‍♂️. "田家水図 (Denka suizu): “village and water scene” — a pastoral motif. This inscription is written in cursive Japanese kanji (草書体) and seems to describe a tsuba (sword guard). It reads approximately as follows: 尚古堂光暁 竪丸形　赤銅地　金象嵌 田家水図　彩色色絵 Romanization: Shōkodō Kōgyō Tatemaru-gata shakudō-ji kinzōgan Denka suizu saishiki iro-e Translation: “By Shōkodō Kōgyō. Vertical oval shape, shakudō ground with gold inlay. Depicting the scene of fields and water, with colored decoration.”

What is it with these two guys going over the bridge? https://www.jauce.com/auction/p1205198985

I think it is Jakushi - mainly from the scene but Jakushi also have nunome or very fine gold "wash" which doesn't seem evident.

Good question, and I challenge anyone here to give me a good definition of it. For example, what makes one ji nie better than another?

Kris, pic better this way. More on swordsmith (also see Naval Swords part 1 in NMB Downloads at top of page for examples) Looks to be well made and saya looks interesting custom work? Kanenaga, Amaike Ginjiro (包永天池 銀次郎) (older brother of Masatsune) born 4 September, 1884 (Showa 17), registered as Seki smith at Seki 15 June, 1941 (Showa 16) and living at Daimon-cho, Seki-machi. He may not have made (many) Navy swords. Kanenaga died March 8th 1958 (Showa 33, his posthumous Buddhist name was Enkaku Chikyō (円覚智鏡). Common mei: Nōshū Seki no jū Kanenaga kore saku (濃州関之住包永作之), Kanenaga (包永)

That is a difficult and highly subjective discussion. It is fraught with problems such as: - what is an “artistic merit” and who judges that? - how can we isolate “artistic merit” from eg engineering and structural integrity, balance, cutting ability etc - why are we trying to assume consistent application of standards over the last 60 odd years of shinsa judgements, when in reality there were different panels with different views / weights and slightly different absolute and relative criteria? I posit that it is not possible to draw definitive conclusions over the entire period NBTHK judgements have been conferred. And that is fine. They have evolved as has the subject. For instance, I noticed that in the “problematic” 1970s, when there was some rampant Juyo issuance, a number of Juyo certificates were issued to swords made by Ichige Tokurin. See one such example below. In my view, his swords are not pretty and do not have artistic merit. The hamon is plain, the whole execution uninspiring.. Yes, he was interesting in that he was a samurai retainer who turned swordsmith. But do his swords have historic importance or artistic merit? In my humble view not really.

Noshu Seki ju Kojima Katsumasa saku. https://www.google.com/search?q="katsumasa"+site%3Amilitaria.co.za%2Fnmb&sca_esv=466299774e926d41&rlz=1C1ONGR_enUS1136US1136&sxsrf=AE3TifMzTHJWEbwPPAiDq7onW05EExDk_Q%3A1761223903873&ei=3yT6aIuENeuFwbkPmPPyuQo&ved=0ahUKEwjL76OprrqQAxXrQjABHZi5PKcQ4dUDCBE&uact=5&oq="katsumasa"+site%3Amilitaria.co.za%2Fnmb&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiJCJrYXRzdW1hc2EiIHNpdGU6bWlsaXRhcmlhLmNvLnphL25tYkjosQFQxW1YlK8BcAJ4AJABAJgBPKABxAOqAQE4uAEDyAEA-AEC-AEBmAIAoAIAmAMAiAYBkgcAoAfoArIHALgHAMIHAMgHAA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp

That is a beauty, Conway, and a new one for the files, thanks! That makes 15 examples so far. Wouldn't mind getting one of these in my collection some day. Going to have to sell my wife's car, though, to get the cash.

They might be Obikazari (帯飾り) - Sash ornament. Ref. 銀製ぶら（帯飾り）｜珍しい和装の装身具（アクセサリー）｜オリジナル帯飾りクリップ（プレート）付き | べっ甲かんざし･髪飾り･和装小物専門店 銀座かなめ屋

This little lacquered carrying cup may be made from the same material as the ashtray haizara netsuke above. The concentric rings and little pinpricks look similar. Could be hazé 櫨の木, wax tree.(?) Upright cup

Hi David, unfortunately this appears to be a Chinese fake. The style of the handle wrap, fittings, and tang, are all wrong and rather crude.

I think this text by Hon'ami Kôzon, translated by AFU Watson, deserves to be read very carefully, especially by those who see daimei everywhere.

Remember that this thread is focussed on the evolutions in iron tsuba, if I have understood it correctly. Beautiful elaborate sukashi work in copper brass, gold, silver and gilt was evident in armor fittings from very early on. The artistic techniques were certainly there for soft metals. Returning to iron, holes were drilled in the iron of kabuto plates and shapes were applied to the edges of iron haraidate-dai, upright holders for maedate. There were fashions for Kabuto bowls such as for the famous bulbous Akoda shape, indeed I sense fashions in Kiku chrysanthemum tsuba could have followed these as the triangular iron bowl plates curved outwards, following numbers such as 12, 16, 24, 32 or 62 etc. Kuruma ‘wheel’ tsuba (not Guruma, except inside compound words) also favoured set numbers of spokes, as did kiku chrysanthemum tsuba. There may have been corresponding fashion changes in armor outfits that included kabuto and tsuba on swords. But in iron? Did they have the files for fine work? Am I alone in seeing numbered spoke consistencies between kabuto plates and tsuba spokes? Here is a tsuba for age consideration. What do we think? An evolution from older yamagane tsuba? The hitsu ana are contemporary with the tsuba.

All you need to learn is how to avoid reflections. The rest is easy then.

It's a noble cause Erik and one I approve of. Very few people take the time to optimise the photography of nihonto, which is a shame as there is so much beauty that is lost to the casual observer. I get as much pleasure from taking photographic images of my blades as I do studying their history. Darcy and Pablo are the two pioneers who really sparked my desire to improve my own skills. I'm by no means a photographer and had limited equipment when I started last year. My camera is an aging Fujifilm XT2 with the kit zoom lens. I quickly realised to capture all the fine detail a sword has to offer, a macro lens was essential. I bought a cheap, used Laowa 65mm F2.8 from Ebay Kleinanzeigen. The lens is manual only but I think the way manual focus works on the XT2 there is no problem getting pin sharp photos in combination with the Laowa. Next most important consideration were the light sources and I think it's true to say there is no universal light that will highlight every feature in the hada, hamon and boshi. After a few experiments the primary light sources I use now are an Ikea Jansjö LED lamp, which was recommended on a forum dedicated to macro photography. These are unfortunately discontinued but you can easily find them listed on Kleinanzeigen and I bought four for 5 euro each. To see the hataraki in the hamon, I discovered a high intensity halogen light with a dimmer to control output produced the best results (I think this is what Pablo Kuntz's photographer uses). Finally a tripod is critical when implementing longer exposures and I use the Fujifilm iPhone App to control the shutter release so there is zero risk of unintended movement. Here are some images I took from my first session. These are all jpg's without post-processing. You'll find more in the Google Drive folder. Still room for improvement, not least wiping the blade to eliminate all the dust particles . Ikea Jansjö LED lamp/Macro lens/tripod https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hcfbKl8l-efqxqyAxZ4Oe_PdNVX_jwDN/view?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/1crDNe1w38OAxs56JgM0YfQpHB6nDpDWd/view?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/15k7eGF_EwuC_oCAi-dd5qTee_p5E5PgY/view?usp=sharing 250W High Intensity halogen bulb/macro lens/tripod https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ri4luL4j5Lslik8-sYD63RvJ-mJj9jlX/view?usp=sharing iPhone 12/natural diffuse daylight/handheld blade and phone https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ppwmEYqNJq_mI8zImLY5FQg2Vkbu6M-1/view?usp=sharing Good luck

Dear Lewis, This is a research study by Nobuo Ogasawara, conducted for and published in the Tokyo National Museum magazine in 1981. Although I made some small corrections, the translation(AI assisted) still contains some errors, but it should give you the general idea. "" The inscriptions of Shintōgo Kunimitsu, as can be seen from the rubbings presented here, each display individual differences. Broadly speaking, example 1 can be regarded as a representative inscription of the hidari-ji hokan style. Examples 2, 3, and 4 are similar to this, with example 4 bearing the latest date of Gen’ō, and is sometimes regarded as the work of a second generation. What is common among these four pieces is that the forging exhibits a well-developed ko-itame grain pattern, the ji-nie is present, and the blade shows clear ji-kage, resulting in a bright and lively jitetsu. The hamon is a straight temper line (suguha) with well-developed ko-nie, and it features pronounced kin-suji, demonstrating lively activity and excellent workmanship. In contrast, examples 5 and 6, dated to the Kagen and Tokuchi eras, show inscriptions that are finer and weaker in appearance. Despite being early in date, they convey the impression of late-period inscriptions. In terms of inscription style, they are clearly different from examples 1 through 4. Furthermore, the forging shows a pronounced masa-gokoro (straight-grain tendency), and compared to the previous four blades, the nioi-guchi of the hamon is tighter, there is less activity within the ha, and the fukura (blade curvature near the edge) tends to sink. Stylistically, examples 12 and 13 are similar, though their engraving chisels (tagane) are finer and the inscription style differs slightly. Examples 7 and 8, as well as those bearing the Buddhist posthumous name Kōshin, do not use the hidari-ji style, and example 7 also lacks the hokan (north-crown) character. These are considered a different type from examples 1 through 6, though stylistically they resemble 5 and 6. Examples 9 and 10 have overall solid inscriptions, with the third stroke of the ko in Mitsu rendered as a plain “tsu” rather than the variant “フ”. Example 9 features a midareba (irregular hamon) with pronounced kin-suji, and the forging shows a raised texture. Example 10 has an ordinary straight suguha. Example 11 differs greatly in inscription style; although it uses the hidari-ji hokan style, it shows unique characteristics not shared with the others. If anything, opinions have shifted toward a broader view that the pieces in question may date from after the inscription bearing the Buddhist posthumous name Kōshin in Shōwa 4. In that case, the works of Bunpō, Gen’ō, and Genkō would be considered second-generation. However, when it comes to pieces with only the two-character inscription, such as the famous Aizu Shintōgo Kunimitsu, it becomes difficult to determine whether they belong to the first or second generation. A detailed examination of Shintō Gokunikimitsu inscriptions shows that each character varies slightly, making it virtually impossible to estimate the production date based solely on a two-character inscription. Nonetheless, in addition to the common inscription style featuring the “left-character” with a north-crown (hidari-ji hokkan), there are several distinct variants: 1. Those executed with a fine chisel (hoso-zan), where the inscription appears somewhat larger (though in reality almost the same). Examples include works dated to Kagen 4 and Tokuchi 3 (Important Cultural Properties), and, although tachi, the famous Mutsu Shintōgo is included in this group. 2. Those not using the left-character north-crown, such as pieces in the Tokyo National Museum or those bearing the Buddhist posthumous name Kōshin. 3. Those where the “kuni” character is a left-character but the “mitsu” character does not have a north-crown, or where the third stroke of “mitsu” is unusually firm, as seen in the famous Ran Shintōgo. 4. Those with large inscriptions and a firm, rigid style, such as the famous Kojiri Gokunimitsu and the tachi passed down from the Tokugawa family. The four types described above differ from the typical left-character north-crown (hidari-ji hokkan) inscriptions. Based on these differences, it can reasonably be concluded that the inscriptions were not cut by a single hand. Rather than strictly distinguishing first and second generations, it is more plausible to view the head smith Kunimitsu as a single master while Shintō Kunimitsu operated as a collective workshop consisting of multiple smiths. Naturally, certain stages of sword-making required a lead smith, and there may have been several lead smiths working simultaneously, making the finished products the result of collaborative effort. On a larger scale, tasks such as forging, finishing, hardening, and polishing were likely divided among specialists. Although it is difficult to determine the precise scale of the Shintogo Kunimitsu workshop in Kamakura, it is reasonable to assume that multiple smiths inscribed the Kunimitsu signature during the lifetime of the head master. ""

I might also suggest as Peter mentioned the "Ainu" were well outside of traditional Japanese thinking. From the pictures shown of Ainu blades, they appear to be more of an "utilitarian type" and very likely considered necessary tools. Therefore, simply decided not to turn them over to the US military. If this was perhaps the situation, I suspect the military command may have considered it not worth enforcing. Dave M.

Peter, Your Ainu blade topic raises an interesting question. Were the native Hokkaido Ainu not required to turn over their ancestral swords? ( wwII ) I read somewhere there were several thousand swords collected on Hokkaido at the end of wwII. As a matter of fact, my father, a young 11th Airborne soldier was part of an weapons collection mission up the Ishikari river. He returned home with a few typical Japanese swords, Shin gunto, Wakizashi. I would have thought at least one of his bring backs would have been Ainu type. He spoke a few times about the Ishikari weapons collection mission, the types of swords , sizes, colors, etc.. But I don't recall him ever mentioning Ainu. Maybe I simply haven't paid attention, but have any Ainu swords ever shown up on the NMB or otherwise and shown as wwII bring backs. Interesting subject, Dave M.

Chris and Steve raise big issues that I am not sure I am qualified to address. It certainly is the case that what "we" might call "Ainu" refers to a wide range of folks. Starting in the Nara period there were people who didn't buy into the whole Kyoto court/Emperor thing. They went by various names etc etc. By the later Edo period the "Japanese" had spread up to Hokkaido (oh, and down to Okinawa, too). The folks up north were organized in a variety of ways outside the Japanese imperial system, but basically they survived without rice agriculture. Thru the Edo period there was active trade between "Japan" and those folks and there was at least one serious "battle" that involve matchlocks and I assume other Japanese weapons. Bottom line is that there probably never was anything like a single cultural group that were called "Ainu" just like there never was a community of "Indians." What seems to me to be the case is that cultural communities in Hokkaido developed distinctive costumes and regalia and it became a commodity much as had Native American materials. Edo period also used swords and various other objects to mark individuals and families as allies. Just as colonial leaders had done in America, Siberia, China, and India, such weapons were given to both empower and mark allies - who then were also of course, able to profit from such relationships. So, what probably were pretty good Japanese swords made it north. So did lots of low-end "Trade Goods." There were also lots of showy ornaments. By Meiji times, Japan seems to have been awash in "old swords" and lots of that stuff made its way north. And then, starting in Meiji times and continuing up to today, there has been active trade in souvenirs - omiyagi - that present "Ainu motifs." Thanks for listening. Peter