okakke-mei

[John A Stuart]

Hi All Can some one tell me if okakke-mei means the same as gimei. John

[steve rb]

Hi, you're obviously looking at the same tanto as I just have. Had also never heard of okakke-mei. A google turned up only the 1 hit, and that was the auction in question!!

 

No idea.

[Brian]

Always expect misspelling! (and the Spanish Inquisition :lol: )

Okkake mei - "A signature applied by another as a mark of respect."

 

That's all I could find right now, but a search should pull up a bit more.

 

Brian

[John A Stuart]

Hi Brian, So, sounds like another way of saying gimei. I've seen examples of this on tsuba if I remember aright and there is a signature of the actual artisan as well. A nijimei okakke-mei just seems unproven as to what the intent was in the 13th cent. without any inscribed dedication. Thanks Brian

Steve, the Rai attribution smacked my face at that price (so far). John

[Ludolf Richter]

If the owner of a sword orders someone to chisel a Mei into an unsigned blade (or does it himself) it's still Gimei.,even when he has a definite knowledge on the swordsmith who made it.I have read of some pre WW II-

examples where this had been done to improve the value of the pieces.

"Okakke-Mei" is definitely not a sword term from the Nihonto community.

A sword owner from the pre-NBTHK/NTHK-Origami-era with an unsigned blade from a famous swordsmith could have let an expert put a Kinpun/Kinzogan-Mei (in gold or laquer) on the blade.Ludolf

[John A Stuart]

Hi Ludolf, It is a new term for me. The tanto which is in poor condition and may be beyond recovery is signed Rai Kunimitsu, the dealer used the term okakke-mei. Seems like a deception to me. Anyhow a rai c.1280 $500 bucks, crazy. John

[Ludolf Richter]

I totally agree with you,John!Ludolf

[Guest Simon Rowson]

Hi all,

 

One of the Japanese dealers I occasionally buy fittings from told me off recently for using the term gimei!

 

He informed me that "it is not the swords fault if it starts off as a perfectly good mumei sword and then, later in it's life, it has a dubious signature added to it".

Apparently, we should show more respect by calling it "atomei" which means "later signature".

 

I still don't know if he was telling me this because he was truly sensitive to the feelings of his sword's incumbant "spirits" or whether he had a trunkful of gimei blades in the boot of his car.

 

All the best,

Simon