Chinese Fake Shinkai

[Surfson]

If I'm not mistaken, this person has been selling mumei blades made in China, and I think that the sword that was put through the NTHK-NPO shinsa was from this same shop.  My opinion was always that their swords are interesting (though worrisome) modern hand made swords and they should sign their name on them and sell them for what they are - a modern attempt to make a traditional method Japanese sword.  

 

This one appears to be different to me from their previous efforts, as it is a clear fraudulent attempt to deceive a potential buyer into thinking they are buying a sword made by Inoue Shinkai.  Just my two bits worth.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Japanese-Samurai-Sword/232791981856?hash=item36337bbf20:g:W1oAAOSwqqRa7nMb

 

[ROKUJURO]

I cannot read the MEI, but offering a "SHINKAI" for $ 330.-- is not too fraudulent in my eyes.

[Brian]

I think you are correct Robert. And the description is clearly intended to deceive.. :From used sword market, no paperwork with it. Relist. No return"

[drjoe]

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/24821-the-other-komonjo/
 

the sword you posted actually looks pretty good and diverges from the usual characteristics of these "fake" swords.  this one has a natural-looking hamon and an unusual amount of ara-nie throughout the blade.  the jigane looks good and the kissaki is well-formed.

were it not for the seller and the signature, i'm not sure it would be readily identified as a non-nihonto.

[Surfson]

That's exactly right Joe.  This maker has decided to take the lower road, not the high road.  In front of our eyes this curiosity is becoming a serious crime.

[Stephen]

past sales... he has another ebay name we have talked about before

 

https://www.ebay.com/sch/wblwbl12/m.html?item=232791981856&hash=item36337bbf20%3Ag%3AW1oAAOSwqqRa7nMb&LH_Complete=1&rt=nc&_trksid=p2046732.m1684

[paulb]

Sorry gents but I disagree this sword looks anything but pretty good. Were it thought to be Japanese then the only explanation for the extremely ugly ara nie is that at some point in it's history it has been badly burned. Nie is jewel like and beautiful, this is scaly and down right ugly.

 

The only thing on this that shows a marked improvement on earlier Chinese fakes is the shape.

[Surfson]

Paul, I am not making the point that the work has improved to the point that an expert like you can't tell it's a fake.  But rather, this one, unlike the other ones being sold by the two ebay sellers that Stephen has pointed out, has a name of a famous maker put onto the artificially aged tang.  While the others could be generously viewed as "copies", by putting a fake name of a famous artist on it, this one must now be referred to as a fraud.  

[Ray Singer]

There was recently a Chinese copy with a gimei of Enomoto Sadahito & Sadayoshi (purporting to be a gassaku). So, shinsakuto as being copied as well (and in this case, patination of the nakago is not necessary)...

[paulb]

Robert

I fully understood and agree with your point. Once something is misrepresented as this has been a threshold has been crossed and it effectively become fraud and criminal. The comment I was really responding to was :

"the sword you posted actually looks pretty good and diverges from the usual characteristics of these "fake" swords"

 

and as said I don't think it looks pretty good.(Other than the shape). 

[Surfson]

Whoever is making these swords could probably finish the nakago, then sign the finished nakago with their own name, devise a nice carved logo (like kiku mon or minatogawa,but personalized) and get a following of collectors willing to pay the same as they are fetching now.  In fact, currently, the ugliest part of them is the obviously artificially aged nakago.  Though I agree with Paul about the nie etc., some of them have interesting hada.  

[tokashikibob]

The hobby is really going to have a hard time attracting new enthusiasts with the quality of fakes hitting the market now.    Stinking fakes!

[John A Stuart]

If it involves money, it can be faked. Museums are full of faked art and artifacts. Always; caveat emptor. John

[Curran]

If it involves money, it can be faked. Museums are full of faked art and artifacts. Always; caveat emptor. John

 

https://edition.cnn.com/style/article/french-museum-half-paintings-fake-intl/index.html

[John A Stuart]

An example of greed ruining good intent. John

[drjoe]

Robert

I fully understood and agree with your point. Once something is misrepresented as this has been a threshold has been crossed and it effectively become fraud and criminal. The comment I was really responding to was :

"the sword you posted actually looks pretty good and diverges from the usual characteristics of these "fake" swords"

 

and as said I don't think it looks pretty good.(Other than the shape). 

 

to be clear, i wasn't trying to say that this is a "good" piece compared to a real Japanese shinsakuto or nihonto, just that is looks significantly better and less cartoonish than most of the fare from these sellers, which are readily recognizable as fakes.  i stand by the fact that many would be hard pressed to differentiate this blade from one made in Japan but for the signature -- its sugata, kissaki, jigane, and hamon are comparable to the real thing.  in general ara nie is never seen in chinese fakes -- i wasn't trying to argue that the profuse ara nie that is spread all over this blade is a good thing so much as i was trying to suggest it does make it harder to differentiate from true nihonto.

 

most of the komonjo blades look strange and asthetically off in various ways.  likewise, the changtian-sword items often have significant forging flaws and also cartoonishly ridiculous hamon.  this one doesn't really have any of those features.  i think most of what we've seen to date are failed attempts in one way or another, but overall the quality is getting better.

 

but i certainly agree, as with the komonjo blades, that these are deliberate frauds and bad for the art of nihonto in general.  i also agree that were they sold without a signature or with the seller's actual signature/stamp they might very well sell at a pricepoint above what these usually go for.  instead, this appears to be a work in progress with a deliberate attempt to mislead and one that's getting harder to detect.

 

[HunterRedFalcon]

Thanks for info.