Shin Gunto To Review & Ask For Assistance

[BenVK]

back to org nakago, one can force corrode a nakago, its done all the time. 

 

Really? but you don't have any proof?  

 

You know what guys, forget it.

Paul, it's been a pleasure, but I'm done with this. It's not my sword and not even Erwin is interested anymore so why am I wasting my time?

Nos da! 

[Stephen]

EXACTLY!!!

[paul griff]

Have you got a problem ? I'm being polite here and you seem to be looking for conflict....Grow up.

Paul

[paul griff]

Hello Stephen,

The reply wasn't for you.....I was a bit slow on he trigger....Regards Paul.

[Stephen]

I know Paul, all is good, with you!

[SwordGuyJoe]

I was wondering how a thread started with an obvious fake could be two pages long. Now I see (backs slowly away from the keyboard).

[PNSSHOGUN]

[SwordGuyJoe]

LOL!

[SwordGuyJoe]

There should be a third axis charting humility. It's amazing how humble some of the most seasoned collectors are, when discussing their "expertise". That's one of my favorite parts of this hobby. Every time you learn something, you find five other things that you didn't know.

[PNSSHOGUN]

I can't believe I missed it but this sword is actually in the Fuller & Gregory book I recommended, here is a photo of the example. 

 

Locally made Javanese example, explains the crudeness. Would be an interesting addition to a collection I suppose. 

 

 

[Shamsy]

I will be the first to eat the humble pie. It's a genuine WW2 sword, not strictly Japanese but not a 'fake' either. Worth buying, because it's a documented collaboration sword.

 

Now, I will point out that the original arguments all stand. No way were the fittings Japanese, not even close to the real thing. The mistake made is that instead of being a fake, the blade is an island sword.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Well said, I concur. This is one of those mythical "1%" cases of a fake looking sword being technically real. 

 

Only happened to notice it while flicking through the replacement copy of military swords I got today, hadn't read it in years.

 

Never seen one for sale, worth getting for the rarity/oddity.

[Shamsy]

VERY well picked John, I would have (and did!) totally miss that. I'm actually really happy I've seen it, since I've not seen one before and may never do again.

[Stephen]

Well glad you military guys fawn over it, its still a copy of a gunto and a nasty one it is!

[SwordGuyJoe]

I will eat my humble pie as well. It is an AUTHENTIC and ANTIQUE "island sword". I don't see the draw but certainly appreciate the rarity.

 

Everyone get ready for about a dozen "island sword" attributions of Chinese work. I've said it before and I'll say it again. If you hear hooves pounding in the background, think horse, not zebra. Though this would be an example of turning around and finding a zebra.

[Brian]

You guys are funny
Agree. yes..we make mistakes. Better to err on the side of caution. But good outcome. Should be more desirable than an NCO. But probably won't be.

[Bruce Pennington]

VERY well picked John, I would have (and did!) totally miss that. I'm actually really happy I've seen it, since I've not seen one before and may never do again.

I'm stumped that I didn't think of that before, as I've defended a few of these over the past 3 years, but for some reason, it never occured to me this time! I'm searching for past examples and have a couple over on Warrelics (even with the same katakana):

 

http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/appraisal-some-Japanese-swords-please-sword-number-3-a-398208/

 

a couple here:

 

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/20284-my-friends-gunto-looking-to-identify-as-much-info-as-possible/?hl=%2Boccupied+%2Blands&do=findComment&comment=207650

 

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/20876-island-made-gunto/?hl=%2Boccupied+%2Blands&do=findComment&comment=212799

 

And at Gunboards:

Stegel

Jo Saku

 

Members

160 posts

LocationAustralia

Posted 30 March 2016 - 04:53 PM

Back to the OP and topic of this thread, there was a lot of discussion over at Gunboards with this subject, opinion appears to be equally divided.

Here's a few links if you are interested :

 

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?473825-2nd-sword-what-is-it

 

and this one has pictures of Indonesian and Chinese collaborators with Japanese style swords:

 

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?385909-Senior-NCO-Sword&highlight=SENIOR+SWORD

[Shamsy]

I think, Bruce, because this is so obviously a very poor attempt to imitate a kai-gunto no one actually considered it could be anything else. Not to mention the nakago that looks like an awful attempt at false aging by the Chinese. The original assessments were reasonable, but ultimately wrong.

[Bruce Pennington]

Yes, I was thrown off too! The "occupied lands" gunto tend to use inferior metals and/or forging (I don't know the metalurgical science), and corroded must faster. Also, the nakago is always poorly formed which sets them up to look just like a fake.