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Collectors Beware !


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#1 Gilles

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 09:50 PM

I've just had an issue with J REID who was selling a tsuba on the NMB under the tittle Iron Tsuba Signed: "ikken" With Kao and I need to report that to you with Brian support.

As I was the first to answer, we started to exchange by the NMB messenger. I asked questions and he answered to them.

We found an agreement yesterday night and he gave me all the details to pay him with paypal including the sending fees.

Today I came back to work and saw that he sent me the following message "Gilles, I hate to be the bringer of bad news.. but another buyer came through with payment a little sooner than you. The tsuba is now sold. Thanks for your interest".

 

I want to point out that this man is not reliable ! That it is simply not a way to do some business with follow collectors of the NMB. I have been here since august 2006 and it is the first time that this kind of things happened to me. Before that, all the sellers with whom I made some deals here were honest !

He sold that tsuba to a third person because that one paid faster than me ????? We are just not in the same time zone !!!!!!

 

Last but not least, that is a blatant sign of disrespect to me and I have the feeling that I don't deserve that.

 

I hope that my  bad experience will be useful for all of you.


Gilles A

#2 Stephen

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 10:13 PM

Thats BS seller should be banned from sales, Lets hear JR side!


Stephen C.
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#3 vajo

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 10:15 PM

Gilles you are right that is not like gentlemen do. I had some similar stories. But on the other hand thats life. Sometimes it goes bad.

 

Stephen what is BS? I didn't understand the term. 

Thanks

 

 

 

Chris


Chris S. 

 

 


#4 Gilles

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 10:24 PM

Dear Chris,

 

I agree, this kind of thing is not rare but if it happens here between us collectors on the NMB that is quite concerning.


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Gilles A

#5 Nihonto1973

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 10:43 PM

This is NOT the way to do bussines.
👎

Joo
M. J.

#6 Jean

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 10:47 PM

I agree with you Gilles, it happened to me years ago with a member. I was the first one to answer and ready to pay by paypal but the guy accepted another lwhich came later because it was less hassle to send inland than overseas.

Stephen, that's the best laugh I had this week
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Jean L.
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#7 Vermithrax16

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 12:07 AM

That sucks for sure, sorry you did not end up with the tsuba.


Jeremiah L.

 

"I wonder if we're being drawn into an ambush. Ultimately, it doesn't matter. We have to do this. We've already bought tickets for the last dance. And it's going to be a real gala event."  - Robopocalypse 

#8 J Reid

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 12:27 AM

My side is simple. I'm trying to sell something. I had 3 people interested who claimed they were ready to "buy it now". 1 stopped responding after I provided payment instructions. The second (Gilles) was provided with payment directions yesterday, and didn't respond for 24 hours, and the third individual responded immediately and promptly. I merely sold it to the individual with the quicker trigger finger. This is slander boys.
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Josh Reid

#9 Stephen

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 12:58 AM

not slander ...you knew Gilles was in different time zone, JMO you should have waited for second in line. 


Stephen C.
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#10 Vermithrax16

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 12:59 AM

I have run into this issue before (not for swords so far, but other buys) especially in different time zones.

 

My company blocks transaction sites like PayPal etc (and social media sites) from our internet. So if I agree to buy something from someone I usually cannot do it until I get home from work. I do not do financial transactions on a phone, but that's just me.

 

It's standard practice to have an item ON HOLD until and unless an agreement has not been acted upon in a given time frame. If J Reid gave a time to pay by and it was not, then sold item to another buyer, that's fair. If this was not worked out at time of price agreement, buyer does not have a real argument, though I think it sucks. If a time frame was agreed on and buyer was within it, then there is a problem.


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Jeremiah L.

 

"I wonder if we're being drawn into an ambush. Ultimately, it doesn't matter. We have to do this. We've already bought tickets for the last dance. And it's going to be a real gala event."  - Robopocalypse 

#11 J Reid

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 01:13 AM

There was no time frame. After Gilles hmm and haw'd he finally stated he was going to buy it. 20 minutes later I provided him with payment instructions and then it takes him almost 24 hours to respond? Why should I wait for that when I have others who are waiting in line? If Gilles really wanted that tsuba so bad, he should have glued himself to the computer until it was said and done. Like I said "early bird gets the worm". This is ridiculous.
Josh Reid

#12 Stephen

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 01:18 AM

If you gave Payment details and did not hear back for 24, i stand down. Id most likely done the same. Why its always best to hear the rest of the story

 

Signed Paul Harvey!   its a old person thing ...not related.


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Stephen C.
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#13 Vermithrax16

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 01:46 AM

There was no time frame. After Gilles hmm and haw'd he finally stated he was going to buy it. 20 minutes later I provided him with payment instructions and then it takes him almost 24 hours to respond? Why should I wait for that when I have others who are waiting in line? If Gilles really wanted that tsuba so bad, he should have glued himself to the computer until it was said and done. Like I said "early bird gets the worm". This is ridiculous.

Well there you go. 

 

In the future I would ask all sellers (and all I have bought from from NMB have done this) to state in directions a time frame for payment to avoid such issues.

 

Stephen, I SO GET the Paul Harvey reference!


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Jeremiah L.

 

"I wonder if we're being drawn into an ambush. Ultimately, it doesn't matter. We have to do this. We've already bought tickets for the last dance. And it's going to be a real gala event."  - Robopocalypse 

#14 J Reid

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 01:47 AM

Finally someone gets me!! Thank you Stephen!
Josh Reid

#15 Gilles

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:10 AM

M. Reid is ready to do some politics in France. I only see a 12 hours difference which is comprehensible due to the time zone. Moreover, he never talked about other customers waiting in line and sorry for that, I can't be "glued to my computer" because I have to work to get some money back home.

last but not least, with that way of dealing M.Reid can be paid simultaneously by two different customer for the item he is selling ?????

That is simply not a way to due some business.

 

 

Here is the extract of our exchanges of messages

 

Sent Yesterday, 06:41 AM

Dear Josh,

I have enough details now. Let us go for this deal.

My shipping address is : ____________________________.

O.K. for Paypal by gift.

 

Sent Yesterday, 07:48 AM

Okay sounds good, Gilles. Please send payment to: ___________ .. $32 for priority shipping to France. Total $282USD sent PayPal via gift. I'll try to post the tsuba Saturday or Monday -latest. Thanks a lot!

 

Sent Yesterday, 07:49 AM

Sorry I said $30 shipping, didn't I? $30 will be just fine! :)
 

Sent Yesterday, 06:46 PM

Gilles, I hate to be the bringer of bad news.. but another buyer came through with payment a little sooner than you. The tsuba is now sold. Thanks for your interest.

 

 

I will not push this topic farther. People have been warned and the facts talk for themselves.


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Gilles A

#16 vajo

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 10:11 AM

Only a note. If you want to pay with paypal and there is no money on your account you need in the worst case 3 days for the transfer.

 

So my point is. If i had a agreement with someone who will sell or buy i would wait for the money. Thats my personel opinion.

 

I'm sorry for Giles and i understand him.

 

Regards

Chris


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Chris S. 

 

 


#17 kissakai

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 10:11 AM

A diificult situation for both parties

I had similar where I thought I was first but it went to anothert buyer and the seller explained why and his reason was sound

So although disappointed I just waited for another one

It becomes more problematic and maybe heated if someone sold an item for a very low (below it's market) value

 

If I see something that needs some thought/research I'll ask the seller if I can have a little time to make up my decision

They may say no or contact me if someone else makes an offer

Due to the time differential I will inform the seller if I'm going to bed or work so I will be unable to reply for a few hours

If it is something you really desire MP as many safeguards as you can

I would not lose any sleep after not buying this tsuba but the post is useful to show what could go wrong and how it may be averted

 

I suppose the next question is how many sellers have had buyers pull out of a deal at the last moment?

No names required just a bit of feedback


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Grev UK


#18 Brian

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 10:25 AM

I deleted a bunch of unrelated or off topic relies.
Josh, as someone who is often the victim of timezones...I sympathize with Gilles. I do all my internet stuff when I get home from work, usually around 8 or 9pm. Then I go to bed...and although I read emails on my phone the next morning, the next time I download and respond is the same time the next evening.

I cannot accept that people sell items confirmed as sold to someone else without even notifying the buyer or waiting for a response. A 2-3 day turnaround for payment is fair, although not mandatory or course.
You know Gilles is a longtime member and known personally to many here, including a moderator. I find it poor form to sell to someone else in the middle of a deal.
That said...there is no fraud or loss here, and you are free to do as you please with your items. Gilles...while I would be upset myself, this is nothing that is illegal, against any rules, or punishable. Just poor form imho, and reminds everyone to firmly establish the rules of the sale when first making the enquiry. Suggest people firmly clarify the terms when sending the first pm or email. And if a seller is in some major hurry, then also suggest they post in the thread that payment is required within 24 hours. Other interested in the item should also play fair...and give the person who responded first, time to conclude the sale.

 


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#19 J Reid

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 06:54 PM

All words said and done. I have nothing further to add. Lesson learned.


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