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Pistols Avaiable In New York . . . In 1907


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#1 Peter Bleed

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Posted 03 February 2017 - 04:00 AM

In llight of the recent discussion of small hinawaju, there might be interest in this page scanned from the 1907 Francis Bannerman catalog. I love old catalogs, and Bannerman's is always good.  But this one is a reprint so it is not very sharp. Still, it is interesting  to see what Banner had to offer. I am not sure when this  merchandise initially appeared, but some pieces appear to have been sold by 1907. I have none of the WWI era catalogs, but this page had been abandoned by the mid 1930s so this stuff seems to have found homes. In addition to this full page sale, he only had a couple of other Japanese matchlocks and they are very generally treated. He also did not have much in Japanese swords, either. It is almost as if there was special and specific interest in these little bangers

Peter

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Peter Bleed

#2 IanB

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Posted 03 February 2017 - 12:14 PM

Peter,  That is wonderful - thank you. What is a surprise are the prices. $500 was a heck of a lot of money at that date and even the price of a more common item was high enough.

Ian Bottomley



#3 Brian

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Posted 03 February 2017 - 12:42 PM

Agree. Thanks for sharing.

 

Brian


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#4 Bugyotsuji

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Posted 03 February 2017 - 06:50 PM

Great page!

(500 USD for a powder tester is pretty steep, though!)
Piers D

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#5 Hamfish

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Posted 04 February 2017 - 11:23 PM

interesting,

 

$30 back then was a lot, but the jutte ??


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#6 JPGH

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 11:29 PM

Hi everyone, 

 

My apologies for dredging-up this old thread, but I was hoping for a little help?

 

I've been researching the $500 piece at the upper left being offered for sale in this 1907 catalog for a couple of weeks now and haven't found much of anything.

 

From my research: made in China(?), Dynasty made unknown and 20th century crude cast brass reproductions of the piece are being offered and/or sold as originals. 

 

Can someone here please shed more light on this weapon?

 

Thanks in advance for your time and replies.

 

Kind regards,

Jo


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JoJo

#7 Bugyotsuji

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 12:34 AM

Jo, it is a Japanese Kayaku-dameshi powder tester. 火薬試し Ignore the original description. Most of it is wrong.
They are rare but not über rare. I have owned three of them. When a new batch of black powder was made up the gunsmith could test fire in the hand or nailed or strapped to a bench, judging the flash, the smoke and the report whether it looked good.
By the same token as you say there are crude modern castings going around of inferior quality, so be aware! I have taken two or three of them in hand. A good one today should not cost more than $500 US in modern dollars unless it is of particularly fine or unusual workmanship. (No idea what a modern brass copy would make, but I would not want to pay even $50 for one.)
Piers D

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#8 JPGH

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 01:47 AM

Thanks so much for your reply and info, most interesting!

 

I've seen these 'Kayaku-dameshi' while conducting my research into the 1907 catalog's version, but have still not found any examples of this 1907 cataloged piece other than these reproductions...

 

REPRO 001.jpg

 

...being offered and/or sold as original period pieces. 

 

 

I was lucky in finding this 1981 catalog image (although bleary) of the actual gun company who reproduced these and were selling them at $5 USD each:

 

DIXIE GUN WORKS 1981 NO. 130.jpg

 

 

I've found many different examples of authentic original period 'Kayaku-dameshi' you've mentioned, but no authentic original period examples of the 1907 cataloged piece, why is that? 

 

Is the 1907 catalog version in fact Japanese, or is it Chinese?

 

Did the Chinese not make 'Kayaku-dameshi' type pieces to test their black-powder? 

 

 

 

 

 


Thanks,
JoJo

#9 Bugyotsuji

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Posted 11 September 2018 - 11:17 AM

Jojo, I have not had one of those that you show in the hand so cannot say whether or not the ‘original’ version was Chinese, Japanese or indeed Korean. The short butt and straight barrel are not in my experience typical for Japanese Kayaku-dameshi.
There was a similar pocket cannon called a Futokoro-deppo and I find even Japanese authors confuse the two. Yours looks more like a reproduction of a Futokoro-deppo 懐鉄砲, or waist/pocket gun. Such a small gun would be incredibly hard to hold and fire without flash burns, even if you had a handy taper to set it off...
Piers D

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